Should we impeach Bush?

Just curious what this board thinks because the majority seems to be Republican. I don't really want to get into a heavy argument here, just wondering. Should we impeach Bush because he lied about why we went to war? Clinton got an impeachment trial for lying about his personal life, and yet Bush hasn't had anything.

Clinton got an impeachment trial for lying under oath, no matter what it was about. Perjury is perjury, whether the line of questioning was in regards to your personal or professional life.

Yes, I understand that. I was just comparing the two since one is obviously worse than the other. Here's a list of reasons to impeach Bush http//uniorb.com/RCHECK/Rimpeach.htm

only a few more months

I think he's done a terrible job as President but the damage an impeachment would cause to the country would be far greater than anything else he can do at this point.

link doesn't work

just kidding got it to work

http//s236.photobucket.com/albums/ff100/imagercc1/archive/page1/bushblow_700.jpg[" alt=""/img67be2d34d0]

[quote34f7ced1e9="ilanbg"]I think he's done a terrible job as President but the damage an impeachment would cause to the country would be far greater than anything else he can do at this point.[/quote34f7ced1e9]
Yeah that's also what I tell people who want him impeached. As for Iraq I would blame Cheney more than Bush anyway. Still, he shouldn't have been elected (he wasn't really of course) much less re-elected IMO.

[quote34f7ced1e9="theysayjump"]bushblow_700.jpg[/quote34f7ced1e9]
lol. It was perjury but they shouldn't have been dogging Clinton about his sex life anyway. That was ridiculous and made the country look idiotic. I was abroad at the time and it was embarassing.

[quote92565318da="d11m"]only a few more months[/quote92565318da]

+ a year...

Honestly I'm surprised you think most members of the board are Republicans. That's completely opposite of what I see here. )

I'll go ahead and take the opposing viewpoint here. I'm not going to write my usual book on the subject, I'll try to keep this brief and then not get into long-winded back & forths.

First, I'm what you'd call a moderate conservative. I prefer that general term to the term "Republican." I tack a bit to the right on most mainstream issues, but definitely swing left of center on a few. Hence my frustration with both primary parties, as both pressure their candidates to be entirely partisan. I despise extremism and inflexibility, regardless of what party name is attached to it. I liked Clinton as a president, because he was a moderate. I saw Bush as a moderate as well, and I still believe he is on most things. The hard left just doesn't want you to see it.

I voted for Bush. Both times. Of the candidates, I felt he was the best and still do. I couldn't stand Gore, and couldn't stand Kerry.

That said, yes Bush's presidency has had failings. To echo what someone above posted, I lay the blame for most at the feet of his cabinet and advisers. However, as the "chief bottle washer" it's his responsibility to accept or decline their advice and direction, and he's done a bit too much accepting since he's been in office. Most things that trouble me about the administration lie in those people around him, like Cheney and Gonzales. And it's sad because I really liked Cheney as SecDef (he was my SecDef when I was in the service). But as VP, he's just not acted very rationally at time, and Bush has granted him a dangerous amount of power and leeway.

I think Bush is a good man. The people of Texas loved him as governor, so you can't argue that the man isn't a leader. He also managed to win election both times -- even if you're convinced he didn't actually win by the numbers, the numbers were close enough to demonstrate that he still has (had) strong support in the country.

So the buck stops with him and he will forever be judged for his outgoing popularity ratings, but no, I don't believe Bush has done anything to be impeached over.

I agree with Dave except maybe Clinton being a moderate, but's that's another thread. What exactly are you impeaching Bush for? Trying to make our country safe? He may not have done it to most of your liking, but that's what he believed was the right thing to do at the time. Now we're in a situation that's a little touchy to get out of. There's always been conflict in the Middle East, and that will never change. No one can stop the hate that some people feel no matter what we do. We'll see how the next President deals with getting out othere. Sorry for rambling. Just my opinion. BTW, I think most people on this board are more liberal than mnx12 thinks.

Most of Bush's policies I agree with. It's the execution of every one of those policies that's really fucked us over. He attempted to tackle difficult issues (e.g. public education, social security reform), but I can't think of anything he actually [ia6fe278057]did[/ia6fe278057] that was successful.

You can blame his failures on any number of things, and give him credit for a sincere interest in helping the country, but he's still the leader and he's still the one who deserves the primary blame for everything that's gone wrong.

The actual things he's done that deserve impeachment are too controversial. Clinton's impeachment was easy because it was a clear-cut case of guilt; but there are cases that justify everything Bush has done. He may be a poor leader, but that's nothing to impeach him over.

[quote497ce06136="dmorris68"]
That said, yes Bush's presidency has had failings. To echo what someone above posted, [b497ce06136]I lay the blame for most at the feet of his cabinet and advisers. However, as the "chief bottle washer" it's his responsibility to accept or decline their advice and direction[/b497ce06136], and he's done a bit too much accepting since he's been in office. Most things that trouble me about the administration lie in those people around him, like Cheney and Gonzales. And it's sad because I really liked Cheney as SecDef (he was my SecDef when I was in the service). But as VP, he's just not acted very rationally at time, and Bush has granted him a dangerous amount of power and leeway.

I think Bush is a good man. The people of Texas loved him as governor, so you can't argue that the man isn't a leader. He also managed to win election both times -- even if you're convinced he didn't actually win by the numbers, the numbers were close enough to demonstrate that he still has (had) strong support in the country.

So the buck stops with him and he will forever be judged for his outgoing popularity ratings, but no, I don't believe Bush has done anything to be impeached over.[/quote497ce06136]

are you kidding me? Bush is a puppet and never even had control over what toothpaste he uses. The guy is a straight clown who can't even speak whole sentences coherently. He is obvioulsy either 1 or 1A as far as worst American Presidents. His admistration is responsible for so much wrong doing it makes Nixon almost look noble.

As far as impeachment is concerned I wouldnt do it. Only 1 year left on his term and its too late to go that route. We shoudlve done it earlier. Too much potential for American embarassment if there was ever an impeachment trial.

[quote0017e75bc1="good2speed"]Too much potential for American embarassment if there was ever an impeachment trial.[/quote0017e75bc1]
Lol how much more embarrassment is there to go around, you people voted him into office twice. I don't know if there's much we can do to look any more stupid.

[quoteeb74fcbbf8="good2speed"][quoteeb74fcbbf8="dmorris68"]
That said, yes Bush's presidency has had failings. To echo what someone above posted, [beb74fcbbf8]I lay the blame for most at the feet of his cabinet and advisers. However, as the "chief bottle washer" it's his responsibility to accept or decline their advice and direction[/beb74fcbbf8], and he's done a bit too much accepting since he's been in office. Most things that trouble me about the administration lie in those people around him, like Cheney and Gonzales. And it's sad because I really liked Cheney as SecDef (he was my SecDef when I was in the service). But as VP, he's just not acted very rationally at time, and Bush has granted him a dangerous amount of power and leeway.

I think Bush is a good man. The people of Texas loved him as governor, so you can't argue that the man isn't a leader. He also managed to win election both times -- even if you're convinced he didn't actually win by the numbers, the numbers were close enough to demonstrate that he still has (had) strong support in the country.

So the buck stops with him and he will forever be judged for his outgoing popularity ratings, but no, I don't believe Bush has done anything to be impeached over.[/quoteeb74fcbbf8]

are you kidding me? Bush is a puppet and never even had control over what toothpaste he uses. The guy is a straight clown who can't even speak whole sentences coherently. He is obvioulsy either 1 or 1A as far as worst American Presidents. His admistration is responsible for so much wrong doing it makes Nixon almost look noble.

As far as impeachment is concerned I wouldnt do it. Only 1 year left on his term and its too late to go that route. We shoudlve done it earlier. Too much potential for American embarassment if there was ever an impeachment trial.[/quoteeb74fcbbf8]
I wouldn't agree or disagree with anything you said since I can't say I'm an expert on any political topic.

I personally don't like much that Bush has done either, but #1 worst president? I fear that many people hear the extremists and/or propaganda and talk out of their ass when it comes to political debate. Let me just ask you this, can you honestly list all of the "wrong-doing" he has performed?

I'm not trying to condescend or even say your a dumbass, but many people bash Bush without even knowing what the hell a cabinet is. So, really I would like to know what evil he's done (other than maybe a few mistakes), maybe it'll be educational to me.

lol at dmorris' comments about Bush's leadership qualities

[quotef123584eaf="MyungChunHa"]
I wouldn't agree or disagree with anything you said since I can't say I'm an expert on any political topic.

I personally don't like much that Bush has done either, but #1 worst president? I fear that many people hear the extremists and/or propaganda and talk out of their ass when it comes to political debate. Let me just ask you this, can you honestly list all of the "wrong-doing" he has performed?

I'm not trying to condescend or even say your a dumbass, but many people bash Bush without even knowing what the hell a cabinet is. So, really I would like to know what evil he's done (other than maybe a few mistakes), maybe it'll be educational to me.[/quotef123584eaf]

I dont have to list them all. For one Bush declared war against two nations and has yet to develop an exit strategy. He is responsible for the dead soldiers due to his administration's and his own negligence. You may argue that is a military issue and Bush was forced to war given the circumstances. it does not however get him off the hook for failing to consult with the military on appropriate war strategies, something the US military has failed to show in both arenas of war.

So ya any president that unnecessarily puts American lives at greater risk is rated very low in my book.

[quoteb5f0c32959="good2speed"][quoteb5f0c32959="MyungChunHa"]
I wouldn't agree or disagree with anything you said since I can't say I'm an expert on any political topic.

I personally don't like much that Bush has done either, but #1 worst president? I fear that many people hear the extremists and/or propaganda and talk out of their ass when it comes to political debate. Let me just ask you this, can you honestly list all of the "wrong-doing" he has performed?

I'm not trying to condescend or even say your a dumbass, but many people bash Bush without even knowing what the hell a cabinet is. So, really I would like to know what evil he's done (other than maybe a few mistakes), maybe it'll be educational to me.[/quoteb5f0c32959]

For one Bush declared war against two nations[/quoteb5f0c32959]

Odd, I didn't realize the president can declare war...

[quoted3f6c2e0e2="CollidgeGraduit"][quoted3f6c2e0e2="good2speed"][quoted3f6c2e0e2="MyungChunHa"]
I wouldn't agree or disagree with anything you said since I can't say I'm an expert on any political topic.

I personally don't like much that Bush has done either, but #1 worst president? I fear that many people hear the extremists and/or propaganda and talk out of their ass when it comes to political debate. Let me just ask you this, can you honestly list all of the "wrong-doing" he has performed?

I'm not trying to condescend or even say your a dumbass, but many people bash Bush without even knowing what the hell a cabinet is. So, really I would like to know what evil he's done (other than maybe a few mistakes), maybe it'll be educational to me.[/quoted3f6c2e0e2]

For one Bush declared war against two nations[/quoted3f6c2e0e2]

Odd, I didn't realize the president can declare war...[/quoted3f6c2e0e2]

Technically correct. My error a pres cant declare war but as commander in chief he has the authority to move troops into conflicts. Of course Congress can suspend appropriations for the war thereby limiting the funds needed for the president to fight the war. This however never seems to be the case as Congress does not wish to risk the lives of American soldiers overseas in conflict by restricting war funds.

As a result a president moving troops into a conflict is de facto declaration of war as Congress will be unlikely to risk American lives by pulling the budget.

[quotecf84142795="mnx12"]Just curious what this board thinks because the majority seems to be Republican. I don't really want to get into a heavy argument here, just wondering. Should we impeach Bush because he lied about why we went to war? Clinton got an impeachment trial for lying about his personal life, and yet Bush hasn't had anything.[/quotecf84142795]

"I did not have a sexual affair with that woman"
lol
Clinton lied under oath.... to the United States.....It was something he did

Bush was told by the CIA and the British Intel. that there were WMDs.... and he decided that was something important for us to know so he passed that information along to us.

[quotef7c9e8b028="Iloveipods2"]Bush was told by the CIA and the British Intel. that there were WMDs.... and he decided that was something important for us to know so he passed that information along to us.[/quotef7c9e8b028]
Uhh yeah. It was that simple was it?

Everyone up here in Canada that I know is amazed that you elected him ONCE, much less TWICE. I'm extremely surprised that he hasn't been assassinated yet.

[quote06674d0834="JennyWren"]Everyone up here in Canada that I know is amazed that you elected him ONCE, much less TWICE. I'm extremely surprised that he hasn't been assassinated yet.[/quote06674d0834]
I def agree. Does Canada rock? Everything I hear about there is awesomeness...

[quote29bcea39e4="good2speed"][quote29bcea39e4="MyungChunHa"]
I wouldn't agree or disagree with anything you said since I can't say I'm an expert on any political topic.

I personally don't like much that Bush has done either, but #1 worst president? I fear that many people hear the extremists and/or propaganda and talk out of their ass when it comes to political debate. Let me just ask you this, can you honestly list all of the "wrong-doing" he has performed?

I'm not trying to condescend or even say your a dumbass, but many people bash Bush without even knowing what the hell a cabinet is. So, really I would like to know what evil he's done (other than maybe a few mistakes), maybe it'll be educational to me.[/quote29bcea39e4]

I dont have to list them all. For one Bush declared war against two nations and has yet to develop an exit strategy. He is responsible for the dead soldiers due to his administration's and his own negligence. You may argue that is a military issue and Bush was forced to war given the circumstances. it does not however get him off the hook for failing to consult with the military on appropriate war strategies, something the US military has failed to show in both arenas of war.

So ya any president that unnecessarily puts American lives at greater risk is rated very low in my book.[/quote29bcea39e4]
Good points, he definitely should have had a better plan, I would agree with that. I guess what my real issue is that people constantly say he's an evil liar, but how do we know he doesn't have the best interests of the country in mind. I'm somewhat of a cynic myself, but I feel like people hate Bush just to hate him and blame someone, yet they know very little about our government. I mean Sadam did some extremely shady things and Clinton almost went to war with them. So I don't think Bush was really that much of a liar, other than the general sense of President's lying, which all of them do and I doubt that will every stop

[quotea48a8cf8a2="mnx12"][quotea48a8cf8a2="JennyWren"]Everyone up here in Canada that I know is amazed that you elected him ONCE, much less TWICE. I'm extremely surprised that he hasn't been assassinated yet.[/quotea48a8cf8a2]
I def agree. Does Canada rock? Everything I hear about there is awesomeness...[/quotea48a8cf8a2]

Canada's pretty awesome, at least out here on the West Coast. People are pretty laid back, real, honest types. Not too many flaky types. People actually think for themselves, instead of just going with what the media thinks. We're also fairly open-minded, I think. I love my campus (UBC) because there is such a wide variety of people there - all different clothing styles, races, religions, etc, and everyone seems to just get along and not judge each other.

I'm not friends with many Americans in "real life" but I've known enough to know that you can't base your opinion on Americans on what you see on the news. However, the general impression up here is that Americans are arrogant and ignorant. I was downloading a driver for my sound card the other day, and on the website there was a pull-down menu to select your "region", and the options were "USA" or "all other areas". I think this sums up how we think that the States views the world. USA, then everything else which is just "not USA".

I don't watch the news very often (way too depressing) and I don't know much of what's going on in the world, but everytime I do read an article or see the news, all I see is Americans who think that the entire world should do things the way that they want. While I do believe that there are times that outside nations should step into a conflict and get involved, I see the USA trying to meddle with everyone else, imposing their views and ideas on the rest of the world. You aren't the only nation, and just because you are powerful doesn't mean that you are RIGHT.

Please don't think that I hate the USA, I totally don't. I've travelled all the way across from one side the to other by car, and I saw many beautiful things and met lots of interesting people. I'm actually going to be moving to Hawaii for a 4-month work term in January and I'm really looking forward to the opportunity to broaden my horizons and get to know more Americans. I just think that more Americans need to look outside their borders and see the rest of the world in all its richness, not just as "all other areas".

[quote91443a6644="Iloveipods2"][quote91443a6644="mnx12"]Just curious what this board thinks because the majority seems to be Republican. I don't really want to get into a heavy argument here, just wondering. Should we impeach Bush because he lied about why we went to war? Clinton got an impeachment trial for lying about his personal life, and yet Bush hasn't had anything.[/quote91443a6644]

"I did not have a sexual affair with that woman"
lol
Clinton lied under oath.... to the United States.....It was something he did

Bush was told by the CIA and the British Intel. that there were WMDs.... and he decided that was something important for us to know so he passed that information along to us.[/quote91443a6644]

I am a moderate, and I must say you can't even talk trash about Clinton compared to Bush. Clinton was hands down a better president. I don't know why they dragged his personal life into it. Besides him fucking an intern and lying about it he did a much better job as president than Bush has done or ever will continue to do. At this point, I think Nixon was even better. At least Nixon had the brains to put in a wage price freeze. He was a terrible person, but he did have some good ideas. Bush and his cabinet seem to lack good execution of their policies.

^fucking in the mouth is not fucking

[quotec165f72c7c="zdub08"]^fucking in the mouth is not fucking[/quotec165f72c7c]

lolz, Bill was a playa. I am sure he did more than that. He probably fucked a lot more women. Bill was the fricken man, not in the personal sense. I think he was one of the best presidents in terms of how he executed his policies. If he could run for a third term, he would most definitely win yet again.

^^ I'd vote for him. I think that's one of the reasons people like Hilary, actually...

[quote3ddbe75d4a="mnx12"]^^ I'd vote for him. I think that's one of the reasons people like Hilary, actually...[/quote3ddbe75d4a]

I hate Hillary, but the idea of Bill being back in the White House will make me vote for her. )

I'm Liberal, not a Bush fan. He needs to be impeached.... I want answers.

[quote39bf34858a="junkie06"]I'm Liberal, not a Bush fan. He needs to be impeached.... I want answers.[/quote39bf34858a]

Again, impeached for what? Are you going by what you hear in the media? The liberal media. You never hear any of the good stuff that goes on. Only the bad, only the stuff that makes people look bad and sound bad. Bush is actually a great speaker. Very eloquent, etc. He's even says he has a hard time making a speech that other people have written for him. Some of you guys are ruthless on this forum. Bush went to war because Congress voted on it(Hilary). Now that he doesn't have an exit plan, it's all his fault.

anyone else tend to overlook posts when they see the words "made with glittermaker.com"?

[quote8693d1e4d7="ricopet"][quote8693d1e4d7="junkie06"]I'm Liberal, not a Bush fan. He needs to be impeached.... I want answers.[/quote8693d1e4d7]

Again, impeached for what? Are you going by what you hear in the media? The liberal media. You never hear any of the good stuff that goes on. Only the bad, only the stuff that makes people look bad and sound bad. Bush is actually a great speaker. Very eloquent, etc. He's even says he has a hard time making a speech that other people have written for him. Some of you guys are ruthless on this forum. Bush went to war because Congress voted on it(Hilary). Now that he doesn't have an exit plan, it's all his fault.[/quote8693d1e4d7]

HAHA, eloquent speaker. I was a better speaker than him when I was like 8. My aunt could address the American public better even though she does not know one word of the English language. Watching too much Fox news? It is his fault and his cabinet for not having an exit plan.... The Bush administration has done some good things for us, that I can't dispute. Saying he is an eloquent speaker when he cannot even pronounce words like nuclear is being totally absurd lol. I think this thread will end up getting closed soon lol. By the comments you said, you are launching a political war. I respect conservatives, but those comments are just ridiculous. I'm moderate, and I think Dmorris made some good points.

[quote00e87eb327="zdub08"]anyone else tend to overlook posts when they see the words "made with glittermaker.com"?[/quote00e87eb327]

heh! This is off topic, but I will say it anyways. I used to hate your posts, but for some reason now I actually enjoy reading them. wink D

[quote1eb6f54054="ricopet"]Bush is actually a great speaker. Very eloquent, etc. He's even says he has a hard time making a speech that other people have written for him. [/quote1eb6f54054]

You have to be [i1eb6f54054]kidding[/i1eb6f54054] me. That's the most biased remark I've seen in this thread yet. The media is not making him out to be a bad speaker; he [i1eb6f54054]is[/i1eb6f54054] a bad speaker. I've seen dozens of unedited speeches, debates, and addresses—instances in which he's used pre-written words and instances when he had to come up with them on his own—and he's just not a good orator. He uses simple language—and while this can be viewed as politically viable (makes him more accessible to the dumber folk), it certainly can't be viewed as eloquent.

In fact, I can't think of a single politician who's worse at speaking them him. That claim alone makes it impossible to consider your point of view.

[quote80a7b5aadd="ilanbg"][quote80a7b5aadd="ricopet"]Bush is actually a great speaker. Very eloquent, etc. He's even says he has a hard time making a speech that other people have written for him. [/quote80a7b5aadd]

You have to be [i80a7b5aadd]kidding[/i80a7b5aadd] me. That's the most biased remark I've seen in this thread yet. The media is not making him out to be a bad speaker; he [i80a7b5aadd]is[/i80a7b5aadd] a bad speaker. I've seen dozens of unedited speeches, debates, and addresses—instances in which he's used pre-written words and instances when he had to come up with them on his own—and he's just not a good orator. He uses simple language—and while this can be viewed as politically viable (makes him more accessible to the dumber folk), it certainly can't be viewed as eloquent.

In fact, I can't think of a single politician who's worse at speaking them him. That claim alone makes it impossible to consider your point of view.[/quote80a7b5aadd]

lol lollol lol you really are from NY. sighli

Don't bother arguing with ilanbg, he's from NY. He's already got his idea made up in his head(like most people do when it comes to politics and religion). Key word here is "his". Plus you have to realize that you're arguing with a bunch of people ON TEH INTERWEB!

He's not even close to be the least popular president. I'm not a big poli-sci guy but I feel Bush used up most of his political base during the war.

[quotedd924edbfc="Iloveipods2"][quotedd924edbfc="ilanbg"][quotedd924edbfc="ricopet"]Bush is actually a great speaker. Very eloquent, etc. He's even says he has a hard time making a speech that other people have written for him. [/quotedd924edbfc]

You have to be [idd924edbfc]kidding[/idd924edbfc] me. That's the most biased remark I've seen in this thread yet. The media is not making him out to be a bad speaker; he [idd924edbfc]is[/idd924edbfc] a bad speaker. I've seen dozens of unedited speeches, debates, and addresses—instances in which he's used pre-written words and instances when he had to come up with them on his own—and he's just not a good orator. He uses simple language—and while this can be viewed as politically viable (makes him more accessible to the dumber folk), it certainly can't be viewed as eloquent.

In fact, I can't think of a single politician who's worse at speaking them him. That claim alone makes it impossible to consider your point of view.[/quotedd924edbfc]

lol lollol lol you really are from NY. sighli

Don't bother arguing with ilanbg, he's from NY. He's already got his idea made up in his head(like most people do when it comes to politics and religion). Key word here is "his". Plus you have to realize that you're arguing with a bunch of people ON TEH INTERWEB!

He's not even close to be the least popular president. I'm not a big poli-sci guy but I feel Bush used up most of his political base during the war.[/quotedd924edbfc]

You're kidding right? I don't care if you are super left wing or ultra conservative. You cannot say Bush is an eloquent speaker. I'm pretty sure it would be hard to even find 10 people that agree with that statement. Hell, even Bush probably believes that he is a terrible speaker.

[quote80ccf8a462="Iloveipods2"]lol lollol lol you really are from NY. sighli

Don't bother arguing with ilanbg, he's from NY. He's already got his idea made up in his head(like most people do when it comes to politics and religion). Key word here is "his". Plus you have to realize that you're arguing with a bunch of people ON TEH INTERWEB!

He's not even close to be the least popular president. I'm not a big poli-sci guy but I feel Bush used up most of his political base during the war.[/quote80ccf8a462]
If you're going to try to dismiss someone's opinion, why not do so by making an intelligent counterpoint?

And what makes you say that "he's not even close to be the least popular president?" If you look at approval ratings, he's been low enough that no one has been less popular "by far."

[quoted3242fc2a2]If you look at approval ratings, he's been low enough that no one has been less popular "by far."[/quoted3242fc2a2]

http//uspolitics.about.com/od/polls/l/bl_historical_approval.htm[]http//uspolitics.about.com/od/polls/l/bl_historical_approval.htm - Not quite.

And I'm a Conservative Republican, but I won't say Bush is an eloquent speaker. I still believe he's a smart guy, but definitely not a great speaker.

[quote73e2a8fb0f="jordan90"][quote73e2a8fb0f]If you look at approval ratings, he's been low enough that no one has been less popular "by far."[/quote73e2a8fb0f]

http//uspolitics.about.com/od/polls/l/bl_historical_approval.htm[]http//uspolitics.about.com/od/polls/l/bl_historical_approval.htm - Not quite.

And I'm a Conservative Republican, but I won't say Bush is an eloquent speaker. I still believe he's a smart guy, but definitely not a great speaker.[/quote73e2a8fb0f]

http//www.hist.umn.edu/~ruggles/Approval.htm

The only thing saving his "average" approval rating is 9/11 which would have gave any president a boost. If you look at his current ratings, they are some of the lowest ratings of all presidents.

That poll was after his first term, like 3 years ago. I'm sure it's gone way down since then

[quote33116a7267="jordan90"][quote33116a7267]If you look at approval ratings, he's been low enough that no one has been less popular "by far."[/quote33116a7267]

http//uspolitics.about.com/od/polls/l/bl_historical_approval.htm[]http//uspolitics.about.com/od/polls/l/bl_historical_approval.htm - Not quite.

And I'm a Conservative Republican, but I won't say Bush is an eloquent speaker. I still believe he's a smart guy, but definitely not a great speaker.[/quote33116a7267]
LOL like others have said that was from the end of his first term before his approval rating plummeted. His approval rating has been as low as 29%.

does anyone know the guy personally? Why would you make comments on someone that you know only from the media? I know people who have talked with him in private and it's them I will take the opinion of. Yes, I'm biased. Why not express my opinion. You're pretty biased yourself by the things you say. Aren't we all biased in some way or another? Everybody has their own opinion. It's what makes the world go round.

[quote1a5a5650cb="zdub08"]anyone else tend to overlook posts when they see the words "made with glittermaker.com"?[/quote1a5a5650cb]
Aw, man. (off-topic) I'm so computer illiterate when I do something like that, I get real proud. You just shot my creativeness down the drain. cry

When you try to state an opinion like that please back it up. My graph shows his current approval rating. Notice how it starts off very high when he first got in office. Then, take a look at what it is now. If people thought he was doing a good job, he wouldn't have such a low approval rating.

The link I posted showed previous Presidents' ratings on the chart, not Bush's. His were talked about about, but that's not what I was pointing to. I was just responding to those who think Bush is the least popular President ever, which is obviously not true. And if you want to talk about low approval ratings, we should be talking about congress, not the President.

[quotec14c0cb4a9="ricopet"]does anyone know the guy personally? Why would you make comments on someone that you know only from the media? I know people who have talked with him in private and it's them I will take the opinion of. Yes, I'm biased. Why not express my opinion. You're pretty biased yourself by the things you say. Aren't we all biased in some way or another? Everybody has their own opinion. It's what makes the world go round.[/quotec14c0cb4a9]

You're missing an integral part of politics. One of the major roles the President has is representing his country and himself in the media accurately. Obviously of the billions of people who have heard of him, only a few thousand have met with him personally. Everyone else must judge him based on how he is able to present himself, and if he can't do that successfully then he's not a very good President. On an international level he discredits the country and on a national level he fails to effectively implement his policies, even the ones that [ic14c0cb4a9]could[/ic14c0cb4a9] have been great (i.e. No Child Left Behind Act, social security reform).

[quote58694fb0a6="jordan90"]The link I posted showed previous Presidents' ratings on the chart, not Bush's. His were talked about about, but that's not what I was pointing to. I was just responding to those who think Bush is the least popular President ever, which is obviously not true. And if you want to talk about low approval ratings, we should be talking about congress, not the President.[/quote58694fb0a6]
Yeah that makes a lot of sense. I guess that's why you quoted me when I am not the one who said he had the lowest approval rating. roll

[quote38c9d8066e="hehehhehe"][quote38c9d8066e="jordan90"]The link I posted showed previous Presidents' ratings on the chart, not Bush's. His were talked about about, but that's not what I was pointing to. I was just responding to those who think Bush is the least popular President ever, which is obviously not true. And if you want to talk about low approval ratings, we should be talking about congress, not the President.[/quote38c9d8066e]
Yeah that makes a lot of sense. I guess that's why you quoted me when I am not the one who said he had the lowest approval rating. roll[/quote38c9d8066e]

[quote38c9d8066e]If you look at approval ratings, he's been low enough that no one has been less popular "by far."[/quote38c9d8066e]

Unless I'm reading this wrong, you did say that. Anyways, this is my last post in this topic because it's pointless debating on the internet.

[quotea0c839f18e="ilanbg"][quotea0c839f18e="ricopet"]does anyone know the guy personally? Why would you make comments on someone that you know only from the media? I know people who have talked with him in private and it's them I will take the opinion of. Yes, I'm biased. Why not express my opinion. You're pretty biased yourself by the things you say. Aren't we all biased in some way or another? Everybody has their own opinion. It's what makes the world go round.[/quotea0c839f18e]

You're missing an integral part of politics. One of the major roles the President has is representing his country and himself in the media accurately. Obviously of the billions of people who have heard of him, only a few thousand have met with him personally. Everyone else must judge him based on how he is able to present himself, and if he can't do that successfully then he's not a very good President. On an international level he discredits the country and on a national level he fails to effectively implement his policies, even the ones that [ia0c839f18e]could[/ia0c839f18e] have been great (i.e. No Child Left Behind Act, social security reform).[/quotea0c839f18e]Yes, you're right. I tend to hear the positive in things I guess. The media reflects only the bad and you only get that side of the situation. I know you don't like to hear things like this, but there are some good things that are happening in Iraq. We had a person speak to us that's from Iraq and he had many great things to say. I have relatives over there and they have a different opinion than most do over hear about the situation. Because they see the whole thing, not just the media side.

Lets spread the blame around to everyone.

The president and his ratings are horribly low. The democrats hate him because of policy and the Republicans (which I am one) are hacked because he is not the president that he ran as. His social policies, except for tax cuts, have been completely different than we thought we would get as a Republican president.

But if we are truthful, the latest polls show that the Democartic led congress is even worse off in the approval ratings polls. It has been an absolute failure for the past year. They have gotten nothing passed, and are hacking off their base.


I think the basic problem is that for whatever reason, the poilticans we elect are not following through with thwe ideals that they expouse on when they are running. Bush needs to understand that the Dems are never going to like him and that he should have held to Republican beliefs and agendas and he wouldn't have hacked off his base. Thus higher ratings.

The Dem Congress should have understood that the Republicans are never going to agree with them, and that they should show who they are and try their hand at what policies and programs they really want in place. At least their base would be happy.

The question is should we impeach Bush? No, he broke no laws. You may hate him and it may be the popular thing to say, but he broke no laws and therefore shouldn't be impeached.

Just my two cents.

[quote4416ab7498="jordan90"][quote4416ab7498]If you look at approval ratings, he's been low enough that no one has been less popular "by far."[/quote4416ab7498]

Unless I'm reading this wrong, you did say that. Anyways, this is my last post in this topic because it's pointless debating on the internet.[/quote4416ab7498]
You are reading it wrong. Follow the context. Someone said he isn't even close to being the least popular president. While there have been a few presidents that have gone below 29% (Truman to 22% for example), it's foolish to say he isn't "even close" to being the least popular when only 7% separate his low with the all time low. His rating still lingers in the 30's. I shouldn't have quoted 'by far' (meant that no one is less popular than him by a wide margin, as implied by 'not even close') and instead quoted it exactly as he said it though.

And that "pointless debating on the internet" is a cop out. If you have something valid to say you should go ahead and say it.

[quote4416ab7498="mookieb2"]No, he broke no laws. You may hate him and it may be the popular thing to say, but he broke no laws and therefore shouldn't be impeached.[/quote4416ab7498]
Again, not saying he needs to be impeached but weren't those wiretappings illegal?

[quote44819325ed="ricopet"]Yes, you're right. I tend to hear the positive in things I guess. The media reflects only the bad and you only get that side of the situation. I know you don't like to hear things like this, but there are some good things that are happening in Iraq. We had a person speak to us that's from Iraq and he had many great things to say. I have relatives over there and they have a different opinion than most do over hear about the situation. Because they see the whole thing, not just the media side.[/quote44819325ed]

Just because there are some good things happening doesn't mean that the war still isn't a disaster. You don't need to follow the media's bias to realize for yourself that almost everything that [i44819325ed]could[/i44819325ed] go wrong with the war already has.