I Didnt Want to Believe it

( OK not sure if ythis has been posted yet. People had been telling me about this bull and I didnt want to believe it, but I gave it a chance and actually looked at the facts and watched the video.
Its a shame the government was acutally behind 9/11. Makes me think twice.

http//www.loosechange911.com/[]http//www.loosechange911.com/

That video raises a lot of questions, but why would the government do something like that?

Its total BS. My friend made me watch and it doesn't account for a lot of variables and has many inaccuracies.

ie The scenarios they had about planes being used as weapons are one of probably millions of scenarios that the government makes for all kinds of incidents.

Been posted several times actually. Don't look at the video as fact, but don't look at what the government tells us as fact either. It sucks, but that's about all we can do is admit that we [bf92a831e7d]don't[/bf92a831e7d] know and to take [bf92a831e7d]each[/bf92a831e7d] side of the story with a block of salt.

lol

I watched some of that video, but you do realize you can make things say what you want them to say, right?

It's a huge conspiracy theory that has been posted and discussed here and on virtually every other board I frequent. It's nothing but B.S.

That's not to say there aren't factors and circumstances leading up to and following 9/11 that were shady, but in no way did our government have a direct hand in the planning and hijacking of those planes and the deaths of 3000 Americans. The idea and the evidence presented in that so-called "documentary" are ludicrous.

That sort of thing is just fodder for those who also believe we never went to the moon, and that Lee Harvey Oswald didn't shoot JFK.

women

[quote0287b88f8b="dmorris68"]It's a huge conspiracy theory that has been posted and discussed here and on virtually every other board I frequent. It's nothing but B.S.

That's not to say there aren't factors and circumstances leading up to and following 9/11 that were shady, but in no way did our government have a direct hand in the planning and hijacking of those planes and the deaths of 3000 Americans. The idea and the evidence presented in that so-called "documentary" are ludicrous.

That sort of thing is just fodder for those who also believe we never went to the moon, and that Lee Harvey Oswald didn't shoot JFK.[/quote0287b88f8b]

Well unless you work with the very heads of the government and governmental branches, you really can't know what happened.

To believe this as unwaivering fact, as well as what the government tell you happened/happens is foolish.

The fact that "we" were led to war based on a fabrication is enough to make me not trust the government. If you could ask Bush today if he thought the war was worth everything that's happened, was going well and if he'd do it again, he'd answer yes to everyone one of those questions.

Doesn't mean they're true.

[quotee9d9e4ad93="aguy"]women[/quotee9d9e4ad93]

oh this was actually posted by a man

[quote69c80f719f="dmorris68"]It's a huge conspiracy theory that has been posted and discussed here and on virtually every other board I frequent. It's nothing but B.S.

That's not to say there aren't factors and circumstances leading up to and following 9/11 that were shady, but in no way did our government have a direct hand in the planning and hijacking of those planes and the deaths of 3000 Americans. The idea and the evidence presented in that so-called "documentary" are ludicrous.

That sort of thing is just fodder for those who also believe we never went to the moon, and that Lee Harvey Oswald didn't shoot JFK.[/quote69c80f719f]

I believe LHO shot JFK and I believe we went to the moon. But Im having a hard time believing those planes really hit the WTC and the Pentagon and caused that much damage. So many questions that I didnt even begin to think about were brought to my attention. I just dont see a plane causing that much. The WTC looked like a planned implosion to me and where were the skid marks on the lawn of the Pentagon?

[quote7ab2e83d36="fashionjunkee"][quote7ab2e83d36="dmorris68"]It's a huge conspiracy theory that has been posted and discussed here and on virtually every other board I frequent. It's nothing but B.S.

That's not to say there aren't factors and circumstances leading up to and following 9/11 that were shady, but in no way did our government have a direct hand in the planning and hijacking of those planes and the deaths of 3000 Americans. The idea and the evidence presented in that so-called "documentary" are ludicrous.

That sort of thing is just fodder for those who also believe we never went to the moon, and that Lee Harvey Oswald didn't shoot JFK.[/quote7ab2e83d36]

I believe LHO shot JFK and I believe we went to the moon. But Im having a hard time believing those planes really hit the WTC and the Pentagon and caused that much damage. So many questions that I didnt even begin to think about were brought to my attention. I just dont see a plane causing that much. The WTC looked like a planned implosion to me and where were the skid marks on the lawn of the Pentagon?[/quote7ab2e83d36]

I think it's fairly obvious that the planes did hit the WTC, that something hit the Pentagon and that a plane crashed in a field in PA.

[quote5e2b956d49="theysayjump"][quote5e2b956d49="fashionjunkee"][quote5e2b956d49="dmorris68"]It's a huge conspiracy theory that has been posted and discussed here and on virtually every other board I frequent. It's nothing but B.S.

That's not to say there aren't factors and circumstances leading up to and following 9/11 that were shady, but in no way did our government have a direct hand in the planning and hijacking of those planes and the deaths of 3000 Americans. The idea and the evidence presented in that so-called "documentary" are ludicrous.

That sort of thing is just fodder for those who also believe we never went to the moon, and that Lee Harvey Oswald didn't shoot JFK.[/quote5e2b956d49]

I believe LHO shot JFK and I believe we went to the moon. But Im having a hard time believing those planes really hit the WTC and the Pentagon and caused that much damage. So many questions that I didnt even begin to think about were brought to my attention. I just dont see a plane causing that much. The WTC looked like a planned implosion to me and where were the skid marks on the lawn of the Pentagon?[/quote5e2b956d49]

I think it's fairly obvious that the planes did hit the WTC, that something hit the Pentagon and that a plane crashed in a field in PA.[/quote5e2b956d49]

are u sure?

When you have that much force, heat, and energy dissipation focused in a very small area, all bets are off. Who would have ever thought 100 years ago that a cup full of nuclear material would be enough to obliterate a large city or even a small country in a single explosion?

The WTC was never built to withstand the thousands of degrees of jet fuel that burned and melted the supports. Only the top half needed to pancake to generate enough force and chain reaction to collapse the rest of the structure. I watched an interview with one of the original architects of the WTC who was not at all surprised at what happened. He said it was never built to withstand such a thing because such a thing was never conceived -- they were more concerned about wind and earthquake damage and ordinary textile/electrical fire damage, not thousands of pounds of jet fuel being ignited immediately following two 600mph impacts of jumbo airliners.

I read a very detailed account by a Pentagon survivor that disputed all the facts in that documentary about the pentagon crash. There WERE most definitely pieces of aircraft wreckage found, and the plane was heard flying in moments before impact.

To produce this piece and promote the idea that none of what happened ACTUALLY happened, in my opinion seriously disrespects the memory of the victims and their families. It's fine and well to question and dispute the government and their actions leading us to war and all the other things that governments are wont to do... but this is stepping over the line. The bottom line is 4 planes carrying innocent citizens crashed that day, into two structures. There are plenty of independant non-government sites on the net that pick this video apart and refute every aspect of it. If you're going to base your opinions off one side of a controversial point of view, at least have the respect to consider the rebuttal evidence.

These conspiracy theories take hold, first of all, because everybody wants to believe in controversy and cover-ups. But most of all, you can produce a slick "documentary" like this based on absolutely NO FACTS by just spinning an interesting yarn that is difficult to DISPROVE. You can claim anything you want to be true, and until there is irrefutable evidence to the contrary, somebody out there will believe and create a movement around it.

I'm going to bow out of this discussion now, not only because I'm an admin and am not supposed to get involved in political issues here on the board, but also because this is a hot topic that really gets my blood pressure up -- and I don't need that after a hard days' work when I come here to unwind.

[quotefe5a4f5999="dmorris68"]
Only the top half needed to pancake to generate enough force and chain reaction to collapse the rest of the structure.
[/quotefe5a4f5999]

exactly.. u drop a 100 ton item on top of a building and it will go down..

The only "conspiracy" theory I realistically believe is that Oswald didn't shoot JFK. It's not that out of the question.

Has anyone read "Crossfire" ?

[quote81df23594d="aguy"][quote81df23594d="dmorris68"]
Only the top half needed to pancake to generate enough force and chain reaction to collapse the rest of the structure.
[/quote81df23594d]

exactly.. u drop a 100 ton item on top of a building and it will go down..[/quote81df23594d]
Blah. If you can show me an incident in the history of the world where a single plane with about 10000 gallons of jet fuel (aka kerosene) took down a buidling as massive as the WTC then Ill begin to believe your arguement.
Take a look at these facts.
http//www.loosechange911.com/wtc.htm[]http//www.loosechange911.com/wtc.htm

Wikipedia has some sites that Debunk the video. http//en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loose_Change_(video)#Debunking shrug

A 47 story steel building (WTC7) not hit by anything, and with only a few small fires, had collapsed as a perfect implosion would...

You really ought to read up on the specifics of the WTC design. In retrospect, it's a flawed design due to the fact the skin of building was taking up so much of the load. This is why the floors pancaked.

I'm stunned people try to debate this. It's almost as clear as day.

That said, there could be a conspiracy to cover up what happened to flight 93. All the major theories as to what caused the crash have almost equal plausibility.

I see the government got to you too Tholek.

All the cool people are being brainwashed. cry

Typical liberal BS roll

I'm surprised the buildings didn't topple over just being hit by the jets. You could say I feel more secure in skyscrapers now wink

I'm leaning towards the theory that the burning jet fuel weakened the supports in the floors it occupied, which caused the chain reaction mentioned. Hasn't anyone ever stood on a coke can and then have someone knick it, causing you to crush the can? Pretty much the same principle shrug

[quote5c62cf8d4b="ajasax"]I'm surprised the buildings didn't topple over just being hit by the jets. You could say I feel more secure in skyscrapers now wink

I'm leaning towards the theory that the burning jet fuel weakened the supports in the floors it occupied, which caused the chain reaction mentioned. Hasn't anyone ever stood on a coke can and then have someone knick it, causing you to crush the can? Pretty much the same principle shrug[/quote5c62cf8d4b]

well thats what they were made for.. to withstand high winds blowing them over and shaking from earthquakes.

And the buildings were enormous as is.. they made those planes look tiny

[quote5fc0760a01="theysayjump"]I see the government got to you too Tholek.

All the cool people are being brainwashed. cry[/quote5fc0760a01]

If that's what it takes to be cool, then I'll supply the clorox. ;)

Seriously though, I'm not that trusting. It's just on this issue, and this film (which has been pretty thoroughly debunked), that I choose to accept the facts that require the least suspension of disbelief.

Flight 93 is another matter, and I don't exactly believe the official verdict on that.

To pull a stunt of such proportions would require many people to be involved. With all of the "scandals" going on, I'm sure one of those people would not hesitate to expose this crap theory if it were true.

[quote5410daa5a4="Gigante"]To pull a stunt of such proportions would require many people to be involved. With all of the "scandals" going on, I'm sure one of those people would not hesitate to expose this crap theory if it were true.[/quote5410daa5a4]

Exactly.

Nixon couldn't break into an apartment, and Clinton couldn't even get a blowjob without anyone knowing. I seriously doubt Bush could kill 3000 Americans, blame it on someone else, and no one figure it out.

[quote3edad0b19b="jreeder"][quote3edad0b19b="Gigante"]To pull a stunt of such proportions would require many people to be involved. With all of the "scandals" going on, I'm sure one of those people would not hesitate to expose this crap theory if it were true.[/quote3edad0b19b]

Exactly.

Nixon couldn't break into an apartment, and Clinton couldn't even get a blowjob without anyone knowing. I seriously doubt Bush could kill 3000 Americans, blame it on someone else, and no one figure it out.[/quote3edad0b19b]
It wasnt Bush who did it. He was a "puppet" so to speak. It was the Project for a New American Century, a neo-conservative think tank whose members include Dick Cheney, Donald Rumsfeld, Jeb Bush and Paul Wolfowitz.

[quote3edad0b19b]exactly.. u drop a 100 ton item on top of a building and it will go down..[/quote3edad0b19b]
The planes weren't "dropped" from the top of the building, they were slammed into the side. The planes were tiny in comparison to the massive buildings. Explain what happened to WTC7.....

[quote3edad0b19b]To pull a stunt of such proportions would require many people to be involved. With all of the "scandals" going on, I'm sure one of those people would not hesitate to expose this crap theory if it were true.[/quote3edad0b19b]
You cant compare 9/11 to any of those scandals. This is on a whole different level.

[quote6fb6d40f58="fashionjunkee"][quote6fb6d40f58="Gigante"]To pull a stunt of such proportions would require many people to be involved. With all of the "scandals" going on, I'm sure one of those people would not hesitate to expose this crap theory if it were true.[/quote6fb6d40f58]
You cant compare 9/11 to any of those scandals. [b6fb6d40f58]This is on a whole different level.[/b6fb6d40f58][/quote6fb6d40f58]

His point exactly.

fashionjunkee Let me get this straight you watch one video, and now you're a conspiracy theorist? You're as bad as those people who watch FOX News. Trust me, I've gone through all this information, watched these videos, and most of it doesn't hold water. Read more than just one site. Come on now.

you people watch way to much 24 wink

[quote85de07f038="Nimh"]fashionjunkee Let me get this straight you watch one video, and now you're a conspiracy theorist? You're as bad as those people who watch FOX News. Trust me, I've gone through all this information, watched these videos, and most of it doesn't hold water. Read more than just one site. Come on now.[/quote85de07f038]
Ive watched more than one video. No one said Im a conspiracy theorist. Why does it have to be a conspiracy? Because you think something different automatically makes you a conspiracy theorist? So if someone killed someone and you believe that it didnt happen that way, yet most of the population does that in turn makes you a conspiracy theorist?

Point is, you watched a video full of bullshit and makes claims without any shred of evidence (Flight 93 being landed safely at Cleveland Hopkins Airport and evacuated by government personnel into an unused NASA research center). No fucking piece of evidence whatsoever and people believe it. Incredible. I am sure there are some truths in there too but it is mostly bullshit and the technical inaccuracies make that apparent (these guys aren't even sure of what a 757 is). Not saying that the truth is out but this certainly isn't it.

People make these videos to get attention mostly, and in this case, it's a guy wanting to be a director.

Anyway, this government used faulty info and went to war in Iraq where tens of thousands of civilians have been killed along with thousands of American soldiers. That should be enough for you to "not want to believe." Concentrate on things they have done and not on bullshit spewed out by conspiracy theorists (a dime a dozen) with a camera.

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[quotec7fc008054="hehehhehe"]Point is, you watched a video full of bullshit and makes claims without any shred of evidence (Flight 93 being landed safely at Cleveland Hopkins Airport and evacuated by government personnel into an unused NASA research center). No fucking piece of evidence whatsoever and people believe it. Incredible. I am sure there are some truths in there too but it is mostly bullshit and the technical inaccuracies make that apparent (these guys aren't even sure of what a 757 is). Not saying that the truth is out but this certainly isn't it.

People make these videos to get attention mostly, and in this case, it's a guy wanting to be a director.

Anyway, this government used faulty info and went to war in Iraq where tens of thousands of civilians have been killed along with thousands of American soldiers. That should be enough for you to "not want to believe." Concentrate on things they have done and not on bullshit spewed out by conspiracy theorists (a dime a dozen) with a camera.[/quotec7fc008054]

i would agree with ya on this one

[quote47a3b1af36="hehehhehe"]Point is, you watched a video full of bullshit and makes claims without any shred of evidence (Flight 93 being landed safely at Cleveland Hopkins Airport and evacuated by government personnel into an unused NASA research center). No fucking piece of evidence whatsoever and people believe it. Incredible. I am sure there are some truths in there too but it is mostly bullshit and the technical inaccuracies make that apparent (these guys aren't even sure of what a 757 is). Not saying that the truth is out but this certainly isn't it.

People make these videos to get attention mostly, and in this case, it's a guy wanting to be a director.

Anyway, this government used faulty info and went to war in Iraq where tens of thousands of civilians have been killed along with thousands of American soldiers. That should be enough for you to "not want to believe." Concentrate on things they have done and not on bullshit spewed out by conspiracy theorists (a dime a dozen) with a camera.[/quote47a3b1af36]
Blah screw this governemnt, especially the Bush administration.

fashionjunkee, from your comments, it seems you had a bias against this administration to begin with, and that the film fit your opinions.

As for me, I'm not exactly a fan of the administration either, but I judge stuff like this objectively. In this particular case great effort is put into arranging facts to fit a conclusion, rather than let the facts speak for themselves.