Arab-Israeli Conflict

Where do you guys stand on this thing that has been going on for a while?

Personally i think that the israeli occupation is completly unjust and illegal by the geneva convention

Please respond rationally and thoughtfully - let's not make this another "gay" thread where 3/4ths of the posts are confrontational and incendiary.

Thanks.

Agreed.

I think that Israel is the Holy Land, and that the Jewish People had it a long time before the Palestinians. I also think that the Palestinians have no right preaching about peace when they do what they do.

However, I'll also say that I do not agree with many of the acts that the Israeli government has done, and will admit that neither is doing very well to move toward peace. I'll also say that the Israelis are being much more open and peace-moving, and that the Palestinians are not accepting any of the good things being thrown at them.

I will also say that both Israel and Palestine have the right to land, and the ability to govern themselves.

well i sympathize with the Palestinian's for the most part eventhough they are idiots because they sold alot of the land and they left in the first place because the Palestinian leadership told them to leave cause after the war is over they will have their homes back well that was wrong. Also i sympathize with the Israelis because it is their holy land but really they did steal it after the holocaust because well the US and the Brits wanted them to have it. People call Palestinian's terrorists but really Sharon is the terrorist that man has killed more people then he can count i mean people want to try him for warcrimes for the murders in the refugee camps in Lebanon. People argue that hamass kills 20 people on a bus they are terrorists but the Israeli army kills 300 people with a few bombs from their American made F-16's and they are just defending Israel. Either way its bullshit and the U.S. just protects the country of Israel so really they arent going anywhere and we cant really do shit about it. The land belongs to the Palestinians but to bad it will probably never ever go back to them.

Israel really should back off some of the land, but their actions by moving into the West Bank have been completely justified with by the Palestinitan bombings. Palestintians need to learn to use their words.

Since Arafat died i think that people think that he wanted a means of driving Israel by way of unnesscary violence cuz it looks they are gettin higher in volume now and its spreading. First jordan got hit in November and i think its gonna grow till someone does something. and the U.S. isnt helping

Arafat didnt really help the situation he was more of a hinderence. The U.S. doesnt help and Israel is piece of shit country politically speaking.

I believe the formation of Israel was a huge mistake of the British.

Here's nearly the same scenario played out backwards. We lose WWI to the Triple Entente and the turks decide it would be a good idea to take New Mexico and give it to the Mexicans. Don't you think the people living in New Mexico have a right to be fucking pissed off?

It's just one block of ancient colonial bullshit that will keep biting everyone in the ass for a very long time.

But then you get in to the question of hard liners running both governments and how there is no way in hell this is going to end peacefully.

Chances are it may come down to Israel pulling out of all captured settlements and putting up a total immigration/migration blockade at its borders. There is no easy end to this.

The early Zionists came into a literally almost-uninhabitable piece of desert smaller than the size of New Jersey, inhabited by nomads that made no real claims to the land. After the Israelis developed the land, turning it into a viable oasis through scientific research and smart planning, the Palestinians suddenly wanted back in?

And what about the other Arab countries in the Middle East? If they really wanted to show their solidarity with their oppressed Palestinian brothers, why didn't they take them into their own countries and provide them with food and shelter? Because politically, it gives them excuses for funding terrorism and feeding hate to the masses against Israel. If the Palestinians were safe in another Arab country, most of the Middle East would have no solid leg to stand on in opposition of Israel.

I don't even want to get started on this completely preposterous reaction to some silly Dutch cartoons.

O.K., first of all, to Stroid who blames the creation of the State of Israel on the Holocaust- That is complete bullshit. The Balfour Declaration was signed in 1917, the State of Israel was created in 1948, so where is the correlation between the two? Second of all, read some books, the British did not want to give up their mandate over the land, and they supplied the Arab armies with weapons in 1947-48. Second of all, how can you call Israel a "piece of shit country politically speaking"? What country is more democratic than Israel. The Knesset is democratically elected, it allows Arab Parties to be elected, and disallows fringe Israeli parties that would like to harm the Arabs? Third of all, I suppose that if Ariel Sharon should be tried as a war criminal, so should every general who has ever battled in war. Every person he killed was part of a legitimate defensive act of war, whether declared or not.

To SyrianDoode who believes Israel is occupying the West Bank- please read up on Israel's Peace treaty with Jordan, and then you can come back and make your argument and I will laugh at you harder.

How can anyone sympathize with the Palestinian cause, the Jews have always been willing to live side-by-side with them in peace, but they continually shoot themselves in the foot, and they worsen their position. Please take a look at the proposed Palestine partition plan of 1947, which Israel accepted, and the Palestinians rejected, and then look what they have now, and it is illogical how they could lost so much land in Arab-agressive wars. Their footprint on the map has shrunk continually, and it is their own fault, and they have even rejected treaties to regain their lost land.

The truth is, the Palestinian leaders are trying to do the same thing they are accusing Israel of doing, they want 100% of the land, with zero Jews, and that simply will never happen.

Edit Slease- If you are interested on the topic, please read a few books. What you have said is completely baseless and false. However, I don't blame you as that is what you would think from reading the paper every day.

Yikes to all the anti-arab comments, do you guys really think its all that one sided?

edit The only thing I said that was baseless was my Chances are comment... are you going to challenge the rest?

I think that Jerusalem should be turned into a nationless nation. I honestly forgot what it's called which a bit embarassing, but a land with no leaders, that anyone is free to go to, type thing.

[quoted53a02ba86="shamash"]I think that Jerusalem should be turned into a nationless nation. I honestly forgot what it's called which a bit embarassing, but a land with no leaders, that anyone is free to go to, type thing.[/quoted53a02ba86]

Who would govern it? I've heard that plan before with the UN governing it but I don't think that would sit well with the arabs.

sounds like a bad idea

what kind of laws do you have in natinonless nation?

any rights, or taxes to pay for it?

I understand what you're trying to say

it's just not that simple though.

you would probably end up with anarchy

I know, the UN would "govern it", so it would be owned by everyone.

It would be difficult but I think it could work.

[quote7ab148d294="slease"]I believe the formation of Israel was a huge mistake of the British.[/quote7ab148d294]
It wasn't formed by the British.

[quote7ab148d294]Here's nearly the same scenario played out backwards. We lose WWI to the Triple Entente and the turks decide it would be a good idea to take New Mexico and give it to the Mexicans. Don't you think the people living in New Mexico have a right to be fucking pissed off?[/quote7ab148d294]
Did the mexicans develop the whole infrastructure of New Mexico? You do realize there was a significant amount of Jews there before 1917, who developed the infrastructure for the whole country, and led and controlled it in every way.

[quote7ab148d294]It's just one block of ancient colonial bullshit that will keep biting everyone in the ass for a very long time.[/quote7ab148d294]
Israel was never a colonial asset, it was a mandated asset. Look up what a mandate is, and you'll see that many of the post of WWI mandates are still being disputed to this day. The mandate over Palestine was already divided into more than half, to create Transjordan, which was originally also supposed to be Jewish land. You don't hear any Jews crying to get that land back.
[quote7ab148d294]But then you get in to the question of hard liners running both governments and how there is no way in hell this is going to end peacefully.[/quote7ab148d294]
Actually, Israel has a quite moderate government in power now, and they have throughout most of their history. Which government is a majority terrorist again?

Hes right about the British thing but it was encouraged by both the UK and France

[quoteb2948d4c14="syriandoode"]Hes right about the British thing but it was encouraged by both the UK and France[/quoteb2948d4c14]

wtf, maybe I just don't understand what you are saying due to the lack of grammar, but the UK and Britain are the same thing.

I am saying that the UK (or Britain whatever) and France encouraged the formation of Israel

[quote7283b1d298="freedesktoppc"]O.K., first of all, to Stroid who blames the creation of the State of Israel on the Holocaust- That is complete bullshit. The Balfour Declaration was signed in 1917, the State of Israel was created in 1948, so where is the correlation between the two? Second of all, read some books, the British did not want to give up their mandate over the land, and they supplied the Arab armies with weapons in 1947-48. Second of all, how can you call Israel a "piece of shit country politically speaking"? What country is more democratic than Israel. The Knesset is democratically elected, it allows Arab Parties to be elected, and disallows fringe Israeli parties that would like to harm the Arabs? Third of all, I suppose that if Ariel Sharon should be tried as a war criminal, so should every general who has ever battled in war. Every person he killed was part of a legitimate defensive act of war, whether declared or not.

To SyrianDoode who believes Israel is occupying the West Bank- please read up on Israel's Peace treaty with Jordan, and then you can come back and make your argument and I will laugh at you harder.

How can anyone sympathize with the Palestinian cause, the Jews have always been willing to live side-by-side with them in peace, but they continually shoot themselves in the foot, and they worsen their position. Please take a look at the proposed Palestine partition plan of 1947, which Israel accepted, and the Palestinians rejected, and then look what they have now, and it is illogical how they could lost so much land in Arab-agressive wars. Their footprint on the map has shrunk continually, and it is their own fault, and they have even rejected treaties to regain their lost land.

The truth is, the Palestinian leaders are trying to do the same thing they are accusing Israel of doing, they want 100% of the land, with zero Jews, and that simply will never happen.

Edit Slease- If you are interested on the topic, please read a few books. What you have said is completely baseless and false. However, I don't blame you as that is what you would think from reading the paper every day.[/quote7283b1d298]

my guess is that you are jewish this is why you have such a biased view on this topic i am neither jewish or muslim but i am from an arab country. and arab countries did give the palestians places to live there are refugee camps in Lebanon, Jordan, Egypt, and other arab countries. Israel did not come into existence until after the holocaust and i wasnt trying to imply that this was the only reason but it was the main reason for the actual creation of Israel because after WWII the creation really took place. Ariel Sharon is a war criminal there is no way to legitimize killing thousands of innocent palestinians in refugee camps for example in the Sabra and Shitilah refugee camps in south Beirut he killed a couple thousand unarmed people(women and children). What i meant by politically speaking is that the way they act within the region that they live in its not a good political ideology very isolationistic and they basically attack everyone and say that they are defending Israel well just because they are backed by the U.S. it shouldnt give them the right to do as they please. Look back over the years how many attacks have been condemed by the world that Israel has commited.

On a side note i used to live in Lebanon when Israel used to bomb us and it wasnt a pleasant experience. Granted the Syrians bombed us also and so did the muslims that lived in the country. I want both the people of Israel and the Palestinians to live peacefully but i dont think that Israel is very comprimising and at the same time i think that the Palestinians need to learn to not fight so damn much.

These bombings are going to get really out of hand and one time someone important is going to get hurt like what happened to Moustafa Akkhad

[quotee360552b80="syriandoode"]I am saying that the UK (or Britain whatever) and France encouraged the formation of Israel[/quotee360552b80]

wrong, Britain wanted to keep the mandate as a military base, they did not want Israel to form.

Well the name of the land is Palestine not Israliline or batmitzvahline.

Either way I still dont see a resolution to this issue( edit Well maybe I do...).

Property is always a contested issue between nations/states/cities and even groups. Falkland Islands anyone. How about Jammu-Kashmir

For my take I'll take the Statue of Liberty.

Ny currently holds the claim to the land and takes in all revenue created from tourist visits.

NJ claims that the island actually lies on its state border and that they should recieve the income generated by the Statue.

Granted NY'ers and NJ'ers aren't always best of friends and often take shots at conditions/lifestyle of the other state. With the common denominator always being that NJ is a dumpland. )

I suppose it's a good thing that Nyers and Njers dont have strong religious differences amongst them and that we are all united under the same country.

Do I see this prob going awayyy. No. NJ will always want a stake in the revenue generated from the statue but will always attempt to handle the problem through legal means/public support.

Even if NJ and Ny could go to war with one another it would most likely never happen. Capitalism has created this bond that connects people of their respective state. For instance a NY or Nj er would choose not to harm people in the other state due to the fact he may conduct his work in that state or that he may lose an existing customer base. This aggressive behavior would only inhibit the individuals own financial and personal gain.

Maybe the people of Palestine(Arabs and Jews) need to have a little more respect for their own land and people and create more economic opportunities that benefit everyone.

Now I may have wnet completely off tangent here and some of you are thinking I'm way off. But one things no one can deny is that countries/ states/ groups that have a strong economic presence in the others region are less likely to pursue aggresive behavior and will always try to handle the problems diplomatically. A large reason why China and Russia initially seem to always be against sanctions against Iran and Iraq since they have a large economic state in the two nations.

Alright theres tons of issues that have been overlooked

1. Don't forget about the 6 day war (1967) between Israel by itself (lets also keep in mind that this country is about the size of Rhode Island sp?) and Egypt, Jordan and Syria. In this war Israel captured captured the Gaza Strip and the Sinai from Egypt, the West Bank (including East Jerusalem) from Jordan, and the Golan Heights from Syria. Of this land Israel has now given away most of it. This fact alone should show that Israel has been acting in good faith. I mean wow givng away land when they barely have any in fact they repeatedly over the years tried to give Egypt the Gaza Strip and part of the West Bank but Egypt refused to take it (a point I'll get to later) Perhaps we should give Texas back to Mexico.

2. Up until a couple months ago Palestine was not even a country, but Israel on its own let them have their own Flag and self regulate with their own police force. Yeah that would never happen here period

3. When 9/11 happened most of America wanted to kick the ass of the people responsible. Yet shit like that happens in Israel with a scary regularity, and they don't just go destroy everyone because they could if they wanted in fact when attacked they still use rubber bullets

4. Non of the surrounding Arab countrys are willing to incorporate the palestinians into their own country after repeated offers from Israel. This is because they are rebles and have been expelled from every country they have been in.

5. When all the Palestinians left Israel initially most of the country was useless desert, that the Jews came and made fertile through there kibbutz's and trust me thats no easy task, I have been there and seen it the land is dry and very rocky and its hot and nasty during the day and freezing at night and there is very minimal water

6. I blame the British and French for most of the problems between the Palestinians and the Israelis. Up until they got involved and seperated them things were going fine. They basically came in fucked everything up and then ducked out

7. Also there was the independence war in which a brand new Israel was attacked by [b02cda0269e]6[/b02cda0269e] Arab countrys and Israel fought back and took 25% of the mandate territory

8. I side with Israel they earned the land fair and square and had any of the wars gone the other way all the Jews that lived there would have been basically squashed and by that I mean they would have been expelled if not killed unlike Israel which let the people stay have a flag and be self regulatory

[quote789f5764ea="freedesktoppc"][quote789f5764ea="syriandoode"]I am saying that the UK (or Britain whatever) and France encouraged the formation of Israel[/quote789f5764ea]

wrong, Britain wanted to keep the mandate as a military base, they did not want Israel to form.[/quote789f5764ea]

wrong the British were in terrible condition after the war and knew it didnt have the resources to control all of their bases worldwide. Thus resulting in many former colonies becoming independent and the British choosing to decrease their military presence worldwide. With the large scale reduction even if Britain chose to keep it as a military base it knew it no longer had the influence in the region to promote stability. Britain was weak at this point and din't want to keep exposing itself and having to deal with non domestic issues. It conceded its superpower status and took a backseat to the Americans. My assumption if anything is that Britain agreed to have the Jews take residence in Palestine and act as a confidant to the crown, in that it would share similar interests to that of the British.

[quotecc73c2971c="Stroid"][quotecc73c2971c="freedesktoppc"]O.K., first of all, to Stroid who blames the creation of the State of Israel on the Holocaust- That is complete bullshit. The Balfour Declaration was signed in 1917, the State of Israel was created in 1948, so where is the correlation between the two? Second of all, read some books, the British did not want to give up their mandate over the land, and they supplied the Arab armies with weapons in 1947-48. Second of all, how can you call Israel a "piece of shit country politically speaking"? What country is more democratic than Israel. The Knesset is democratically elected, it allows Arab Parties to be elected, and disallows fringe Israeli parties that would like to harm the Arabs? Third of all, I suppose that if Ariel Sharon should be tried as a war criminal, so should every general who has ever battled in war. Every person he killed was part of a legitimate defensive act of war, whether declared or not.

To SyrianDoode who believes Israel is occupying the West Bank- please read up on Israel's Peace treaty with Jordan, and then you can come back and make your argument and I will laugh at you harder.

How can anyone sympathize with the Palestinian cause, the Jews have always been willing to live side-by-side with them in peace, but they continually shoot themselves in the foot, and they worsen their position. Please take a look at the proposed Palestine partition plan of 1947, which Israel accepted, and the Palestinians rejected, and then look what they have now, and it is illogical how they could lost so much land in Arab-agressive wars. Their footprint on the map has shrunk continually, and it is their own fault, and they have even rejected treaties to regain their lost land.

The truth is, the Palestinian leaders are trying to do the same thing they are accusing Israel of doing, they want 100% of the land, with zero Jews, and that simply will never happen.

Edit Slease- If you are interested on the topic, please read a few books. What you have said is completely baseless and false. However, I don't blame you as that is what you would think from reading the paper every day.[/quotecc73c2971c]

my guess is that you are jewish this is why you have such a biased view on this topic i am neither jewish or muslim but i am from an arab country. and arab countries did give the palestians places to live there are refugee camps in Lebanon, Jordan, Egypt, and other arab countries. Israel did not come into existence until after the holocaust and i wasnt trying to imply that this was the only reason but it was the main reason for the actual creation of Israel because after WWII the creation really took place. Ariel Sharon is a war criminal there is no way to legitimize killing thousands of innocent palestinians in refugee camps for example in the Sabra and Shitilah refugee camps in south Beirut he killed a couple thousand unarmed people(women and children). What i meant by politically speaking is that the way they act within the region that they live in its not a good political ideology very isolationistic and they basically attack everyone and say that they are defending Israel well just because they are backed by the U.S. it shouldnt give them the right to do as they please. Look back over the years how many attacks have been condemed by the world that Israel has commited.

On a side note i used to live in Lebanon when Israel used to bomb us and it wasnt a pleasant experience. Granted the Syrians bombed us also and so did the muslims that lived in the country. I want both the people of Israel and the Palestinians to live peacefully but i dont think that Israel is very comprimising and at the same time i think that the Palestinians need to learn to not fight so damn much.[/quotecc73c2971c]
All Palestinian Refugee camps are run by and funded by the UN. No Arab country has given a penny towards them. It is quite unfortunate that they are still living in these cramped camps, and that they have not yet been integrated into the surrounding Arab lands. Not only do the Arab lands not want them, they purposely keep them open to try and legitimize their cause.

Are you implying Israel would not have been founded if not for the Holocaust? As I said earlier, the Balfour declaration, integrated into the UN Charter, was passed in 1917. Do you completely overlook this? The whole point of a Mandate was for Britain to oversee it until the Jews were ready to take over. While the Jews were ready to take over before 1948, the British wanted to keep it, and it took the UN to kick the British out, which did not happen until 1947.

Ariel Sharon is not a war criminal. It is true that he has made horrible errors, and killed innocent people, and he has apologized for it. He did not intend to kill them, and it is unfortunate that terrorists hide amongst civilians. It was no more than collateral damage in a war. It is very unfortunate, but to put him in the same sentence has Hitler, Millosevich, and Hussein is wrong.

You call Israel isolationist, but they are very friendly with anyone willing to be their friend. How can you blame them for everyone hating them.

You should really read some of the UN general assembly resolutions that you refer to. They are so sloppy, the Arabs submit the same resolutions every year without even changing the date. I think we can agree to disagree on the legitimacy of the vote of the UN GA, as it has become very politicized, and nothing in the GA can be taken seriously anymore.

I respect your opinion, and I think it is pretty unclear that neither of us will convince each other. I have stated my view, and you have stated yours. Unless you would like to bring some new facts or arguments to the table, I think all we can do is anger each other by arguing the same points over and over again, and I don't wish to anger you or anyone else.

[quote97e4d9e49e="PoPoJiJo"]Alright theres tons of issues that have been overlooked

3. When 9/11 happened most of America wanted to kick the ass of the people responsible. Yet shit like that happens in Israel with a scary regularity, and they don't just go destroy everyone because they could if they wanted in fact when attacked they still use rubber bullets

[/quote97e4d9e49e]

They didnt use rubber bullets when my friends cousin was shot in the legs carrying a grocery bag, and when the israeli soldiers found out that the bag wasnt a bomb they guarded the boy and kept anybody from taking him to a hospital. He was eventually saved by some kids who threw rocks at the soldiers and distracted them, and some more kids came from behind and carried him to a doctor.

[quote8cacc7e395="good2speed"][quote8cacc7e395="freedesktoppc"][quote8cacc7e395="syriandoode"]I am saying that the UK (or Britain whatever) and France encouraged the formation of Israel[/quote8cacc7e395]

wrong, Britain wanted to keep the mandate as a military base, they did not want Israel to form.[/quote8cacc7e395]

wrong the British were in terrible condition after the war and knew it didnt have the resources to control all of their bases worldwide. Thus resulting in many former colonies becoming independent and the British choosing to decrease their military presence worldwide. With the large scale reduction even if Britain chose to keep it as a military base it knew it no longer had the influence in the region to promote stability. Britain was weak at this point and din't want to keep exposing itself and having to deal with non domestic issues. It conceded its superpower status and took a backseat to the Americans. My assumption if anything is that Britain agreed to have the Jews take residence in Palestine and act as a confidant to the crown, in that it would share similar interests to that of the British.[/quote8cacc7e395]

Yes, they liuquidated their mideast bases into Palestine after they withdrew from Egypt, Jordan, and Iraq. They were not very happy with Israel's creation after the attacks of the Jews against the British, and they thought that a Jewish state might affect their control of oil in the region. That is why they supplied the Arabs with weapons, while they prevented the Jews from importing any.

[quote2cf73b28eb="freedesktoppc"]O.K., first of all, to Stroid who blames the creation of the State of Israel on the Holocaust- That is complete bullshit. The Balfour Declaration was signed in 1917, the State of Israel was created in 1948, so where is the correlation between the two? Second of all, read some books, the British did not want to give up their mandate over the land, and they supplied the Arab armies with weapons in 1947-48. Second of all, how can you call Israel a "piece of shit country politically speaking"? What country is more democratic than Israel. The Knesset is democratically elected, it allows Arab Parties to be elected, and disallows fringe Israeli parties that would like to harm the Arabs? Third of all, I suppose that if Ariel Sharon should be tried as a war criminal, so should every general who has ever battled in war. Every person he killed was part of a legitimate defensive act of war, whether declared or not.

To SyrianDoode who believes Israel is occupying the West Bank- please read up on Israel's Peace treaty with Jordan, and then you can come back and make your argument and I will laugh at you harder.

How can anyone sympathize with the Palestinian cause, the Jews have always been willing to live side-by-side with them in peace, but they continually shoot themselves in the foot, and they worsen their position. Please take a look at the proposed Palestine partition plan of 1947, which Israel accepted, and the Palestinians rejected, and then look what they have now, and it is illogical how they could lost so much land in Arab-agressive wars. Their footprint on the map has shrunk continually, and it is their own fault, and they have even rejected treaties to regain their lost land.

The truth is, the Palestinian leaders are trying to do the same thing they are accusing Israel of doing, they want 100% of the land, with zero Jews, and that simply will never happen.

Edit Slease- If you are interested on the topic, please read a few books. What you have said is completely baseless and false. However, I don't blame you as that is what you would think from reading the paper every day.[/quote2cf73b28eb]

Im talking about the bombing Zarkawi took credit for last november

it was never theirs to give the palestinians land the land belonged to the palestinians before it was forcefully taken away. Israel didnt win it fair and square thats like saying mexico comes in the U.S. and takes New Mexico , Texas, COLORADO, Arizon, and whatever else state in a war would we just say ok well they beat the U.S. let them keep the land they won it fair and square. No we wouldnt. And your right popo shit like 9-11 happens all the time over there but if you look up and see how many more palestinians die then israelis the #s are very different, if 10 jews die 50arabs die(dont quote me on that but its something like that). Anyways this argument will just go in circles.

[quotedf2a87e7ca="good2speed"]Well the name of the land is Palestine not Israliline or batmitzvahline.[/quotedf2a87e7ca]

And for the sake of arguing before it was called Palestine, it was called Israel. Palestine is just the name the Romans gave to the territory, and nothing more.

[quote3ac60023f9="Stroid"] [b3ac60023f9] I want both the people of Israel and the Palestinians to live peacefully[/b3ac60023f9] but i dont think that Israel is very comprimising and at the same time i think that the Palestinians need to learn to not fight so damn much
[/quote3ac60023f9]

I think that the part in bold expresses how most of the Palestinians and Israelis feel as well as I know I do however I don't see it happeneing any time soon which sucks I also think both sides need to compromise more and start thinking outside of the box on ways to do this instead of the same old shit that they keep regurgatating sp? Personally I think both sides should have to take a piss together and talk because hey many things can be solved by taking a piss wink

[quotecf5a841470="Stroid"]it was never theirs to give the palestinians land the land belonged to the palestinians before it was forcefully taken away. Israel didnt win it fair and square thats like saying mexico comes in the U.S. and takes New Mexico , Texas, COLORADO, Arizon, and whatever else state in a war would we just say ok well they beat the U.S. let them keep the land they won it fair and square. No we wouldnt. And your right popo shit like 9-11 happens all the time over there but if you look up and see how many more palestinians die then israelis the #s are very different, if 10 jews die 50arabs die(dont quote me on that but its something like that). Anyways this argument will just go in circles.[/quotecf5a841470]

When was the last time "Palestinians" ruled the land? It has always been held by a foreign power.

[quotea778d7f9ee="freedesktoppc"][quotea778d7f9ee="Stroid"]it was never theirs to give the palestinians land the land belonged to the palestinians before it was forcefully taken away. Israel didnt win it fair and square thats like saying mexico comes in the U.S. and takes New Mexico , Texas, COLORADO, Arizon, and whatever else state in a war would we just say ok well they beat the U.S. let them keep the land they won it fair and square. No we wouldnt. And your right popo shit like 9-11 happens all the time over there but if you look up and see how many more palestinians die then israelis the #s are very different, if 10 jews die 50arabs die(dont quote me on that but its something like that). Anyways this argument will just go in circles.[/quotea778d7f9ee]

When was the last time "Palestinians" ruled the land? It has always been held by a foreign power.[/quotea778d7f9ee] agreed... but it was known as palestine and the palestinian people lived there. Also i dont think that just because Sharon appologized for those "mistakes" it makes it better thats like saying Hitler said sorry everyone forgive him i realize its not the exact same calibur but you get my point. And in response to what you wrote earlier i agree we wont convince each other and i to respect your opinion but i disagree with it.

[quote01d88b7653="Stroid"]it was never theirs to give the palestinians land the land belonged to the palestinians before it was forcefully taken away. Israel didnt win it fair and square thats like saying mexico comes in the U.S. and takes New Mexico , Texas, COLORADO, Arizon, and whatever else state in a war would we just say ok well they beat the U.S. let them keep the land they won it fair and square. [/quote01d88b7653]

Well I agree with most of what you previously said Stroid and dont disgree to much here but if we lost to Mexico we should just slap ourselves silly and go move in with the Canadaians. But seriously if they took our land from us forcefully and we got bitched out and didnt have enough firepower to attack Mexico( I cant belive were even pretending this would happen) then I guess we are screwed. Obvioulsy we cant fight back so whod fight for us. Maybe England but the rest of the world would laugh and say we got a taste of our own medicine. Well maybe for the first few weeks but then theyd realize they have to much financial stake in this country and that they need us.

G UNIT NICKA

[quoteaddc77196d="shamash"]G UNIT NICKA[/quoteaddc77196d]

BWS Nicca

editli dang it the pic wont work

btw this probably the only time i will ever side with syriandoode and that needs to be a jpg for it to work

[quotecef9c81d38="syriandoode"]lieditli dammit the pic wont wrk[/quotecef9c81d38]

just delete the post then. Oh well too late

[quote03489af414="Stroid"][quote03489af414="freedesktoppc"][quote03489af414="Stroid"]it was never theirs to give the palestinians land the land belonged to the palestinians before it was forcefully taken away. Israel didnt win it fair and square thats like saying mexico comes in the U.S. and takes New Mexico , Texas, COLORADO, Arizon, and whatever else state in a war would we just say ok well they beat the U.S. let them keep the land they won it fair and square. No we wouldnt. And your right popo shit like 9-11 happens all the time over there but if you look up and see how many more palestinians die then israelis the #s are very different, if 10 jews die 50arabs die(dont quote me on that but its something like that). Anyways this argument will just go in circles.[/quote03489af414]

When was the last time "Palestinians" ruled the land? It has always been held by a foreign power.[/quote03489af414] agreed... but it was known as palestine and the palestinian people lived there. Also i dont think that just because Sharon appologized for those "mistakes" it makes it better thats like saying Hitler said sorry everyone forgive him i realize its not the exact same calibur but you get my point. And in response to what you wrote earlier i agree we wont convince each other and i to respect your opinion but i disagree with it.[/quote03489af414]
many Jews also lived there when it was called Palestine. The bottom line, the Muslim Palestinians did not identify as a people until the late 1880s I believe, coincidentally the same time Zionism began. Palestinianism was just a defense to Zionism, not a thousand year old nationality that Zionism impinged on.

Any way it as a pic of the death count for this whole mess

Israelis-998

Palestinians-3170

Since Sept 30 2005

either way i got much love for jews my best friend is jewish and i also have good friends that are muslim. i just agree with the palestinians on this one. Hopefully one day this will be resolved!

It will be resolved only when the Palestinians recognize Israel's right to exist, and give up their hopes of taking over all of Israel. Israel has offered them '48 borders, and even better than that, and they have always turned it down in hopes of getting everything.

[quote13e85ced2a="Stroid"]btw this probably the only time i will ever side with syriandoode and that needs to be a jpg for it to work[/quote13e85ced2a]
lol


[quote13e85ced2a="Stroid"]either way i got much love for jews my best friend is jewish and i also have good friends that are muslim. i just agree with the palestinians on this one. Hopefully one day this will be resolved![/quote13e85ced2a]

It cant go on forever, but i think ill still be kickin when its all over someone is gonna do something. Maybe Hilary... wink

P.S. Not Hilary Duff

[quotea6fc82aacb="freedesktoppc"]It will be resolved only when the Palestinians recognize Israel's right to exist, and give up their hopes of taking over all of Israel. Israel has offered them '48 borders, and even better than that, and they have always turned it down in hopes of getting everything.[/quotea6fc82aacb]yeah your probably right if they dont recognize Israel and realize that they wont get everything then they will be stuck in the same place.

[quote3cf9daaaea="syriandoode"]Any way it as a pic of the death count for this whole mess

Israelis-998

Palestinians-3170

Since Sept 30 2005[/quote3cf9daaaea]

Damn Palestinians are getting blown out. )

Looks like they're gonna have to make a lot of changes this offseason. Players just arent playing hard enough. Think they need to work up the draft. Existing group I think has reached their potential tehy can go no further. I think they need to blow up ( no pun intended) the entire roster as its obvious the current lineup isnt getting it done.

)
)

[quotec71295075f="Stroid"]it was never theirs to give the palestinians land the land belonged to the palestinians before it was forcefully taken away. Israel didnt win it fair and square thats like saying mexico comes in the U.S. and takes New Mexico , Texas, COLORADO, Arizon, and whatever else state in a war would we just say ok well they beat the U.S. let them keep the land they won it fair and square. No we wouldnt. And your right popo shit like 9-11 happens all the time over there but if you look up and see how many more palestinians die then israelis the #s are very different, if 10 jews die 50arabs die(dont quote me on that but its something like that). Anyways this argument will just go in circles.[/quotec71295075f]

ummm actually thats how we got some of those states in the first place we took them from Mexico in a war which was my point in what I said earlier. Thats where the whole remember the alamo thing came from just as a side point

and yes that is fair and square we fought(the revolutionists) the British and took the colonies. Anyways all countrys were formed by war at some point

not to repeat myself but Israel fought a war 6-1 that they did not start and won sounds fair enough to me then they fought a 3-1 war which they did strike first but it is considered with almost no dispute a preemptive strike all in all the land Israel has they got fairly by all rules of war. So unless you are saying that the US having Texas and California is unfair because we took them in a war from Mexico I'm missing your point

[quotedf80553fa2="syriandoode"]Any way it as a pic of the death count for this whole mess

Israelis-998

Palestinians-3170

Since Sept 30 2005[/quotedf80553fa2]
That shouldn't be too much of a surprise. Israel is just far superior militarily. They get all their crap from us.

[quote2a0bc0f059="PoPoJiJo"][quote2a0bc0f059="Stroid"]it was never theirs to give the palestinians land the land belonged to the palestinians before it was forcefully taken away. Israel didnt win it fair and square thats like saying mexico comes in the U.S. and takes New Mexico , Texas, COLORADO, Arizon, and whatever else state in a war would we just say ok well they beat the U.S. let them keep the land they won it fair and square. No we wouldnt. And your right popo shit like 9-11 happens all the time over there but if you look up and see how many more palestinians die then israelis the #s are very different, if 10 jews die 50arabs die(dont quote me on that but its something like that). Anyways this argument will just go in circles.[/quote2a0bc0f059]

ummm actually thats how we got some of those states in the first place we took them from Mexico in a war which was my point in what I said earlier. Thats where the whole remember the alamo thing came from just as a side point

and yes that is fair and square we fought(the revolutionists) the British and took the colonies. Anyways all countrys were formed by war at some point

not to repeat myself but Israel fought a war 6-1 that they did not start and won sounds fair enough to me then they fought a 3-1 war which they did strike first but it is considered with almost no dispute a preemptive strike all in all the land Israel has they got fairly by all rules of war. So unless you are saying that the US having Texas and California is unfair because we took them in a war from Mexico I'm missing your point[/quote2a0bc0f059]

already addressed

Palestinians or Israelis?
Palestinians
31%
31% [ 6 ]
Israelis
68%
68% [ 13 ]
Total Votes 19


guess which i voted for

my point is now not back when the alamo happened but i dont see it being the same situation as Israel/Palestine. In Israel people started moving there after the creation granted many already lived there. But in America it was a revolution i see it differently but i can see what you are saying to. eh either way i gg study and this post is distracting me ;)

[quote10afac3208="johnjimjones"][quote10afac3208="syriandoode"]Any way it as a pic of the death count for this whole mess

Israelis-998

Palestinians-3170

Since Sept 30 2005[/quote10afac3208]
That shouldn't be too much of a surprise. Israel is just far superior militarily. They get all their crap from us.[/quote10afac3208]

Hes 15 this issue is fairly new to him

[quote58c76a9d8b="Kidd"]Palestinians or Israelis?
Palestinians
31%
31% [ 6 ]
Israelis
68%
68% [ 13 ]
Total Votes 19


guess which i voted for[/quote58c76a9d8b]
I don't even understand the question. Are we voted what side we are on?

If you talkin about me i kinda grew up with this thing so i admit im biased toward Palestine but i see their mistakes

[quote7b189c504e="johnjimjones"][quote7b189c504e="Kidd"]Palestinians or Israelis?
Palestinians
31%
31% [ 6 ]
Israelis
68%
68% [ 13 ]
Total Votes 19


guess which i voted for[/quote7b189c504e]
I don't even understand the question. Are we voted what side we are on?[/quote7b189c504e]

whos side do u think is right

id like to give the syrian a round of applause for actually holding up a decent conversation in a thread i am very impressed http//forum.freeipodguide.com/smilies_mod/upload/b88880d441774943f2db282c8e0159ce.gif[" alt=""/img7aa171caba]

[quote7f0e8128a9="Stroid"]id like to give the syrian a round of applause for actually holding up a decent conversation in a thread i am very impressed http//forum.freeipodguide.com/smilies_mod/upload/b88880d441774943f2db282c8e0159ce.gif[" alt=""/img7f0e8128a9][/quote7f0e8128a9]
lol go study

im trying to its just im bored you know

[quote900711e45d="syriandoode"]If you talkin about me i kinda grew up with this thing so i admit im biased toward Palestine but i see their mistakes[/quote900711e45d]

Ya I can tell. Cool how you grew up about this issue in your life and that you now have the mental capacity to absorb all that has happened and to put it into perspective. Hopefully by the time your my age ths issue will be resolved and you will have faith in the world. I've heard way too many Israeli-Palestinian conflicts over the years I gave up hope they'd reach a solution. Maybe sometimes its meant for people just to not like one another.

although Im still fairly certain if enough economic opportunities were provided to each side then there would be no conflict. Maybe I believe in the powers of economic dependencies. Give me a shot at the mideast crsisis. All I need is a few weeks

stroid what honda do you drive

[quoteebdc3c44fb="Stroid"]id like to give the syrian a round of applause for actually holding up a decent conversation in a thread i am very impressed http//forum.freeipodguide.com/smilies_mod/upload/b88880d441774943f2db282c8e0159ce.gif[" alt=""/imgebdc3c44fb][/quoteebdc3c44fb]

[img="ebdc3c44fb]http//forum.freeipodguide.com/smilies_mod/upload/589a3b00a9abcec424faebdc4dffd001.gif[" alt=""/imgebdc3c44fb]

[quote21e7a02143="Kidd"]stroid what honda do you drive[/quote21e7a02143] 2000 Honda Accord EX 5-Speed http/" alt=""/img.photobucket.com/albums/v206/Stroid/img="_0069.jpg[" alt=""/img21e7a02143]
[img="21e7a02143]http/" alt=""/img.photobucket.com/albums/v206/Stroid/HondaAccord2DR4.jpg[/img21e7a02143]

love than vtec i bet )

5 speed manual real nice

any mods?

nice spoiler.

[quotebe5eb5d5ff="Kidd"]love than vtec i bet )

5 speed manual real nice

any mods?[/quotebe5eb5d5ff] nah no mods but it is a vtech i love it

[quote0b798e80a8="Stroid"][quote0b798e80a8="Kidd"]love than vtec i bet )

5 speed manual real nice

any mods?[/quote0b798e80a8] nah no mods but it is a vtech i love it[/quote0b798e80a8]

get a intake preferably short ram and u will hear it come to life especially on a manual when it hit vtec the noise of the crossover is orgasmic

That Shakira icon is hypnotizing.

[quoted10518ae73="Kidd"][quoted10518ae73="Stroid"][quoted10518ae73="Kidd"]love than vtec i bet )

5 speed manual real nice

any mods?[/quoted10518ae73] nah no mods but it is a vtech i love it[/quoted10518ae73]

get a intake preferably short ram and u will hear it come to life especially on a manual when it hit vtec the noise of the crossover is orgasmic[/quoted10518ae73]

get homie a girl.

[quotef3fa42e4fc="Veek"]That Shakira icon is hypnotizing.[/quotef3fa42e4fc]

true that

let the thread hijacking begin twisted

[quoteb25f8fc496="Veek"]That Shakira icon is hypnotizing.[/quoteb25f8fc496]

I hear that

i dont like my car to sound like a rice rocket not really my thing..and yes Shakira is amazing

Did anybody hear about this movie Paradise World? Cuz i wanna find a place where i can watch it

yeah i heard about that movie you will find it in little theaters but i dont think its still playing ill try to find a torrent and its Paradise Now btw

http//www.mininova.org/tor/209933 spanish subtitles but if you speak arabic that shouldnt be a problem im dl it now cause i wanted to watch it also. if someone finds it in english let me know

I think that there is room for a two state solution but it will require cooperation from both sides involved in the conflict. The Palestinians have been treated terribly at times and so have the Israelis.

Hell, I have friends of friends in Israel who to go bed with a gun every night because they suspect that terrorists are around every corner.

That isn't a mentally healthy way to live for either side.

Essentially, both groups are human and deserve to be treated as such. It's just hard to get two mobs of angry people to agree on anything.

[quote2de1eae2f6="Jake"]I think that there is room for a two state solution but it will require cooperation from both sides involved in the conflict. The Palestinians have been treated terribly at times and so have the Israelis.

Hell, I have friends of friends in Israel who to go bed with a gun every night because they suspect that terrorists are around every corner.

That isn't a mentally healthy way to live for either side.

Essentially, both groups are human and deserve to be treated as such. It's just hard to get two mobs of angry people to agree on anything.[/quote2de1eae2f6]

Maybe all they really want is a chance to get an ipod from freepay. )

On a more serious note I'd never thought terrorism would contribute to another man having sexual relations with his gun. 0

btw syriandoode that torrent is dubbed over in spanish i thought it would be subtitles but its not i cant find one in english or arabic

problem with it is that it might be in a palestinian accent so i might skip out on some words or somethin

yeah well the palestinian accent is very similair to the lebanese accent so i will get by it must suck having a syrian accent lol

im gonna go with israel. They owned the land first.....
I dont think this conflict will be solved anytime soon. The hatred between these 2 groups is so intense... I could easily see this conflict going on for decades upon decades till one group completely crushes the other.....

of course, israel is working toward peace, by backing out of gaza/west bank etc etc...

palestine doesnt want peace. they want domination.

[quotea4027ed7ff="shamash"]of course, israel is working toward peace, by backing out of gaza/west bank etc etc...

palestine doesnt want peace. they want domination.[/quotea4027ed7ff] im not even gonna get into this again

[quote914f08049d="Stroid"]yeah well the palestinian accent is very similair to the lebanese accent so i will get by it must suck having a syrian accent lol[/quote914f08049d]

as much as i hate to say it your right. cuz in like regular generic Arabic saying how are is sayin Kayfa Halik like in my sig but in syrian arabic its
kefuck...



no joke