A Scary Thought.

http//news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/4655196.stm

Interesting short article, but this part is what's unsettling

[quotefdb34d2128]And, in a grand finale, the document recommends that the United States should seek the ability to "provide maximum control of the entire electromagnetic spectrum".

US forces should be able to "disrupt or destroy the full spectrum of globally emerging communications systems, sensors, and weapons systems dependent on the electromagnetic spectrum".

Consider that for a moment.

The US military seeks the capability to knock out every telephone, every networked computer, every radar system on the planet.

Are these plans the pipe dreams of self-aggrandising bureaucrats? Or are they real?

The fact that the "Information Operations Roadmap" is approved by the Secretary of Defense suggests that these plans are taken very seriously indeed in the Pentagon.

And that the scale and grandeur of the digital revolution is matched only by the US military's ambitions for it. [/quotefdb34d2128]

Meh, I did a study on EMP fields several years ago. The technology has been out for quite a while in several countries.

I figured out cold fusion

It's not the fact that the technology exists that I find unsettling, it's the fact that they (U.S Government) believe that they should be allowed to "knock out" the entire planets communications systems.

That doesn't bother me, I trust my Government.

there are tons of things the "military" is capable of, they could blow the world up 24 times over, but doesn't mean they will do it. just in case they really needed to they can. oh and what does anything really matter when we have chuck norris.

[quotea2287620ed="Gooogler"]That doesn't bother me, I trust my Government.[/quotea2287620ed]

roll

I don't see any reason why the U.S. would even try to "knock out" the entire planet, but I do see it very useful for localized areas right before ground-troops are deployed. It would even work on missile sites, such as SAM sites.

[quotefee48937dd="Gooogler"]That doesn't bother me, I trust my Government.[/quotefee48937dd]

Switch this countries capabilites with North Korea's. How would you feel if it was North Korea who had the capabilites that this country does, and they wanted to be able to have complete control over the entire planets communications systems, meaning they could shut the whole fucker down if and when they wanted to?

You think you would feel any differently?

Hopefully we wont deploy ground troops in mass numbers anywhere soon.

[quoteb92ae1837e="thehacker010"]I don't see any reason why the U.S. would even try to "knock out" the entire planet, but I do see it very useful for localized areas right before ground-troops are deployed. It would even work on missile sites, such as SAM sites.[/quoteb92ae1837e]

That's the thing though. If they don't have any reason to, then why do they feel like they need the ability, capability or authority to do so?

That would make me uncomfortable, I do not trust them. I see your point though.

DUDE 1 nation under chuck norris

how can anything happen?

[quote77678a3994="theysayjump"][quote77678a3994="thehacker010"]I don't see any reason why the U.S. would even try to "knock out" the entire planet, but I do see it very useful for localized areas right before ground-troops are deployed. It would even work on missile sites, such as SAM sites.[/quote77678a3994]

That's the thing though. If they don't have any reason to, then why do they feel like they need the ability, capability or authority to do so?[/quote77678a3994]

Because man will never be satisfied.

I don't understand the ytmnd Chuck Norris craze.

It's not the fact that they could use it on the entire planet at once, but they could use it on the same place multiple times; just to make sure. )

[quote9a1b7fa0ba="theysayjump"][quote9a1b7fa0ba="thehacker010"]I don't see any reason why the U.S. would even try to "knock out" the entire planet, but I do see it very useful for localized areas right before ground-troops are deployed. It would even work on missile sites, such as SAM sites.[/quote9a1b7fa0ba]

That's the thing though. If they don't have any reason to, then why do they feel like they need the ability, capability or authority to do so?[/quote9a1b7fa0ba]

A different manifestation of survival of the fittest?

Here is a picture of the area that could be effected by an EMP bomb.

http//i19.photobucket.com/albums/b188/thehacker010/b41c7f0a.gif[" alt=""/img08af6b90f8]

Also, the CBU-94 has already been used on Serbia, former Yugoslavia, in 1999. It destroyed the electrical power in the country. I believe it was called, "Operation Allied Force."

[quote7a683a4008="thehacker010"]Here is a picture of the area that could be effected by an EMP bomb.

http//i19.photobucket.com/albums/b188/thehacker010/b41c7f0a.gif[" alt=""/img7a683a4008]

Also, the CBU-94 has already been used on Serbia, former Yugoslavia, in 1999. It destroyed the electrical power in the country. I believe it was called, "Operation Allied Force."[/quote7a683a4008]

ok...now imagine the U.S. using that agains the middle east, Europe, Russia...anywhere! It's just another weapon to give them the upper hand in case anything ever happened.

do you honestly think the U.S. government is just going to send us all back to the stone age w/ no communication whatsoever just for the hell of it?

[quote70814eee94="crazyates"][quote70814eee94="thehacker010"]Here is a picture of the area that could be effected by an EMP bomb.

snip[" alt=""/img]

Also, the CBU-94 has already been used on Serbia, former Yugoslavia, in 1999. It destroyed the electrical power in the country. I believe it was called, "Operation Allied Force."[/quote70814eee94]

ok...now imagine the U.S. using that agains the middle east, Europe, Russia...anywhere! It's just another weapon to give them the upper hand in case anything ever happened.

do you honestly think the U.S. government is just going to send us all back to the stone age w/ no communication whatsoever just for the hell of it?[/quote70814eee94]


I doubt they would do it to their own country, but if you were from or living in another country, don't you think it be a little scary to think that another country could just wipe out your entire communications systems, whenever they felt like they should or needed to?

One man's pleasure is another man's poison.

[quoteebb1643961="skillet2003"]we have chuck norris.[/quoteebb1643961]

and jack bauer

If we don't figure this stuff out someone else will, plus it leads to us discovering a defense against said weapon and deters other nations from entering combat against us.

Also half of the space and weapons programs further advancements in technologies that improve everyday electronics in ways that we never realize or know.

This weapon seems like a perfect one, it wouldn't harm innocent civilians but can still render an enemy powerless in a war.

[quotec629977066="CollidgeGraduit"][quotec629977066="skillet2003"]we have chuck norris.[/quotec629977066]

and jack bauer[/quotec629977066]

haha right

but seriously this is why we're the biggest nation in the world. if we're already #1...what would be have by dominating smaller countries even more?

and remember too...half of it is political. No country would dare go against us in an all out war cuz it wouldn't last more than a week. this is just one more thing of saying "we've got bigger weapons than you...so dont mess w/ Texas"

and ya i would be freaked out if North Korea came out w/ something like this...but that's not the point. we have it...we will continue to make more weapons along this line, and there's nothing they can do about it....(well except maybe the U.N.....but that's different) lol

[quote8ebae996b3="justinag06"]This weapon seems like a perfect one, it wouldn't harm innocent civilians but can still render an enemy powerless in a war.[/quote8ebae996b3]
i agree completely....this could be a very, very useful weapon if we ever needed to go into a battle.....i dont really see a problem with it....

Good point, as long as the american soldiers arent dying its cool

who is that in your avatar crynos??.....mars volta??

[quoteda277506b8="AbSoLuT_xXxEr0"]who is that in your avatar crynos??.....mars volta??[/quoteda277506b8]yeah.


PS. For anyone who didnt notice, that was sarcasm in my other post

[quoted33bf5ca2e="thehacker010"]Here is a picture of the area that could be effected by an EMP bomb.

http//i19.photobucket.com/albums/b188/thehacker010/b41c7f0a.gif[" alt=""/imgd33bf5ca2e]

Also, the CBU-94 has already been used on Serbia, former Yugoslavia, in 1999. It destroyed the electrical power in the country. I believe it was called, "Operation Allied Force."[/quoted33bf5ca2e]
wow and that was almost 9 years ago too.

[img="d33bf5ca2e]http//newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/41265000/jpg/_41265260_rumsfeld_afp203.jpg[" alt=""/imgd33bf5ca2e]
How cool of a picture is that? Good 'ol Emperor Rumsfeld....or Secretary of Defense?

None the less that unsettling. The U.S. Government actually IN CONTROL of the internet. But I can see where taking out all electronics could be useful when attacking other countries (which technically shouldn't happen, but for example North Korea). Taking out radar and other devices.

[quote53bb863e23="Crynos"][quote53bb863e23="AbSoLuT_xXxEr0"]who is that in your avatar crynos??.....mars volta??[/quote53bb863e23]yeah.


PS. For anyone who didnt notice, that was sarcasm in my other post[/quote53bb863e23]
for one, mars volta is a kick-ass band.....but for two, all im saying is that coming from the military perspective and the fact that war/fighting is probably going to occur wether or not anybody likes it (personally i dont believe fighting should be the ultimate answer), its best that we have the upper hand in any situation like that.....eliminating the opponents communications would extremely help out our army.....

point is we are stupid not to continue and look to protect ourselves and allies by utilizing technology.

I know conspiracy theories and hating bush are awful trendy right now, but the U.S. does have enemies and serious threats it deals with on a daily basis.

[quote56879a5d59="crazyates"][quote56879a5d59="CollidgeGraduit"][quote56879a5d59="skillet2003"]we have chuck norris.[/quote56879a5d59]

and jack bauer[/quote56879a5d59]

haha right

but seriously this is why we're the biggest nation in the world. if we're already #1...what would be have by dominating smaller countries even more?

and remember too...half of it is political. No country would dare go against us in an all out war cuz it wouldn't last more than a week. this is just one more thing of saying "we've got bigger weapons than you...so dont mess w/ Texas"

[b56879a5d59]and ya i would be freaked out if North Korea came out w/ something like this...but that's not the point. we have it...we will continue to make more weapons along this line, and there's nothing they can do about it[/b56879a5d59]....(well except maybe the U.N.....but that's different) lol[/quote56879a5d59]

This is what I'm saying. I'm not from this country, but I live here. It would unsettle me if Scotland had this capability or wanted to be able to have the control that this country has. It's just not right. The war in Iraq for example; Great war, really worth all the lives, time and money that has gone into it right? roll Just because a government (notice I didn't say just this one) decides it should go to war, doesn't mean it is needed or is a "Just" war.

Al Qaeda obviously thought the what they did on 9/11 was "just" and needed, but the majority of the world thought differently. Same with the war in Iraq. Just because someone says something is right, or needed or just, doesn't make it so.

The only reason you don't care is because the country you are from/live in has it or wants it. The fact that it would freak you out if another country has it, shows that you don't think it would be a good thing, unless you were in control.

Now maybe you have an idea as to how the rest of the world may feel about something like this.

[quoteedbf89b53b="justinag06"]point is we are stupid not to continue and look to protect ourselves and allies by utilizing technology.

I know conspiracy theories and hating bush are awful trendy right now, [bedbf89b53b]but the U.S. does have enemies and serious threats it deals with on a daily basis.[/bedbf89b53b][/quoteedbf89b53b]

This isn't the only country who has any threats against it. There an absolute shitload of of terrorist organisations in this world and believe it or not, they don't all have a thing for this country.

Spain for instance has ETA. Do Spain want complete control of the entire planets communications systems?

Just for the record, I didn't post this to have some kind of flame-fest or anti-government debate. It just unsettled me that one country seeks complete control of the planets communications systems.

Rest easy the democrats will be back in power soon and all of the issues not being dealt with now will be then. I think the government is doing everythinmg it can now to further protect itself for the longterm.

Keep in mind a lot of the issues here now and today are here because Clinton didn't properly deal with al-quada or goverments like the Taliban for over 8 years. Now be did deal with a lot of important issues on the home front that were ignored during the pervious adminsttations term.

Are you honostly comparing the U.S. to North Korea?

[quote720675c829="theysayjump"]
This isn't the only country who has any threats against it. [b720675c829]There an absolute shitload of of terrorist organisations in this world and believe it or not, they don't all have a thing for this country[/b720675c829].

Spain for instance has ETA. Do Spain want complete control of the entire planets communications systems?

Just for the record, I didn't post this to have some kind of flame-fest or anti-government debate. It just unsettled me that one country seeks complete control of the planets communications systems.[/quote720675c829]

right

and who do they always ask to come help deal with them when they are attacked?

france?

and I would never flame you over your political beliefs, don't worry

D

[quote5f2d7b662f="justinag06"]Are you honostly comparing the U.S. to North Korea?[/quote5f2d7b662f]

No I was trying to put into perspective how if another country had this ability or seeked it, that everyone posting here would have a completely different point of view.

Like I said, I wouldn't feel comfortable if Scotland wanted or seeked to have this ability. There's just something fundamentally wrong a country wanting that much power. There is probably not a politician in the world who someone here could say they trusted 100%, and that has a big part to do with it.

[quotedfa103a291="theysayjump"][quotedfa103a291="justinag06"]Are you honostly comparing the U.S. to North Korea?[/quotedfa103a291]

No I was trying to put into perspective how if another country had this ability or seeked it, that everyone posting here would have a completely different point of view.

Like I said, I wouldn't feel comfortable if Scotland wanted or seeked to have this ability. There's just something fundamentally wrong a country wanting that much power. There is probably not a politician in the world who someone here could say they trusted 100%, and that has a big part to do with it.[/quotedfa103a291]

right I don't think the goal is world domination, but more or less to be able to use this weapon at any given time, in any given place.

Imagine we have world war III tomorrow?

[quote40e6e17500="justinag06"][quote40e6e17500="theysayjump"]
This isn't the only country who has any threats against it. [b40e6e17500]There an absolute shitload of of terrorist organisations in this world and believe it or not, they don't all have a thing for this country[/b40e6e17500].

Spain for instance has ETA. Do Spain want complete control of the entire planets communications systems?

Just for the record, I didn't post this to have some kind of flame-fest or anti-government debate. It just unsettled me that one country seeks complete control of the planets communications systems.[/quote40e6e17500]

right

and who do they always ask to come help deal with them when they are attacked?

france?[/quote40e6e17500]

Nobody perhaps? When was the last time the US did anything about ETA, or the IRA, or even Al Qaeda before 9/11. Hamas? Egyptian Islamic Jihad? My mum went to Egypt quite a lot before she died, and evey time she had to go in an armed convoy if she wanted tot ravel to certain places, because of the terrorsits. They weren't American convoys.

[quotecbd2d41d72="justinag06"][quotecbd2d41d72="theysayjump"][quotecbd2d41d72="justinag06"]Are you honostly comparing the U.S. to North Korea?[/quotecbd2d41d72]

No I was trying to put into perspective how if another country had this ability or seeked it, that everyone posting here would have a completely different point of view.

Like I said, I wouldn't feel comfortable if Scotland wanted or seeked to have this ability. There's just something fundamentally wrong a country wanting that much power. There is probably not a politician in the world who someone here could say they trusted 100%, and that has a big part to do with it.[/quotecbd2d41d72]

right I don't think the goal is world domination, but more or less to be able to use this weapon at any given time, in any given place.

Imagine we have world war III tomorrow?[/quotecbd2d41d72]

I know, I agree that it would become very useful especially against other countries or factions who are only out to cause widespread panic or harm. There's just no need for that at all.

If North Korea went to war with this, or any other country, of course it would only help. But I just don't think that these kinds of things are ever used solely for what they are or were supposed to be.

ps. nice to see you checking out some Ryan

if you want bootlegs or any other material lemme know.

his stuff is schizo from one album to the next.

however heartbreaker and suicide handbook(a 2 cd unmixed all acoustic downer) are right on target

as are his new three releases more or less

[quote1cc52abdde="justinag06"]ps. nice to see you checking out some Ryan

if you want bootlegs or any other material lemme know.

his stuff is schizo from one album to the next.

however heartbreaker and suicide handbook(a 2 cd unmixed all acoustic downer) are right on target

as are his new three releases more or less[/quote1cc52abdde]

Yeah man I just got Heartbreaker last night. I like the arguement at the start about Morissey. D

I have 29 but I can never find any of his other stuff. Shame. (

The Al Qaeda has been on the top terrorist organization list for MANY years. Osama was even listed as the #1 most wanted terrorist leader. The only difference between then and now it that the U.S. is going out of its way to deal with the problems. I'm not trying to play the "what if" game, but some of these problems, such as Al Qaeda, might not have been so bad if the former administration had put more attention on the matter. The fact is, this technology can/has been created. The issue now is who is going to have a more developed form of this technology first.

eth's got a mouthfull of cookies

u cant trust man, thats why i put my faith in a higher entity.

[quote893d3cd7af="kdollar"]u cant trust man, thats why i put my faith in a higher entity.[/quote893d3cd7af]

good...i like that

the question i want to know is why America would develop a weapon that could potentially hurt us more than it could hurt our enemies? Let's say we activated this thing and all electronic communication was suddenly knocked out....who would suffer more..the American Army of the groups of terrorists?

well since the terrorists don't use that much technology and since they would be far less affected by this than we would, why are we building weapons like this?

I read that one problem they had looking for Osama Bin Laden was that they had no practical ways of applying all of thier survailence equipment into wide-spread use. Radio interceptions and other forms of survailence like that were useless cuz the terrorists outsmarted American technology by not using any techlology at all. they used runners to spread information and most cumunication was done by word-of-mouth.

now tell me again how this great new weapon is going to help us catch these terrorists?

I think this would more likely be used to knock out a powerful enemy than small groups of terrorists. I think it is good to have in case of a serious situation that could jeapordize millions of lives.

[quote5d2bfd8cdf="crazyates"][quote5d2bfd8cdf="kdollar"]u cant trust man, thats why i put my faith in a higher entity.[/quote5d2bfd8cdf]

good...i like that

the question i want to know is why America would develop a weapon that could potentially hurt us more than it could hurt our enemies? Let's say we activated this thing and all electronic communication was suddenly knocked out....who would suffer more..the American Army of the groups of terrorists?

well since the terrorists don't use that much technology and since they would be far less affected by this than we would, why are we building weapons like this?

I read that one problem they had looking for Osama Bin Laden was that they had no practical ways of applying all of thier survailence equipment into wide-spread use. Radio interceptions and other forms of survailence like that were useless cuz the terrorists outsmarted American technology by not using any techlology at all. they used runners to spread information and most cumunication was done by word-of-mouth.

now tell me again how this great new weapon is going to help us catch these terrorists?[/quote5d2bfd8cdf]

ok first off it has the potential to knock out power anywhere

that doesnt mean thats how it would be used.

do you realize how stupid that sounds america knocking out power for everyone including ourselves? so we can take fucking canoes and spears over there to fight them man to man.


secondly you're right this wouldn't be very usefull against terrorists.It isn't for some war tomorrow or today, but maybe 30 years from now with multiple superpowers.


do you have any idea how many defense weapons are made that are or never will be utilized?

3.

[quote3b86ae5fe8="theysayjump"]3.[/quote3b86ae5fe8]
Is that so far or your guess?

[quote6dfd73c235="johnjimjones"][quote6dfd73c235="theysayjump"]3.[/quote6dfd73c235]
Is that so far or your guess?[/quote6dfd73c235]

It's a fact.

Google 3 and see what comes up (unutilised dfense weapons).

Oh well, it was bound to happen if you think about it. Its inevitable to stop all different types of perceptions around the world because we'll never agree completely..

[quote797ba968be="akalic"]Oh well, it was bound to happen if you think about it. Its inevitable to stop all different types of perceptions around the world because we'll never agree completely..[/quote797ba968be]

So all different types of perceptions [i797ba968be][b797ba968be]are[/b797ba968be][/i797ba968be] going to be stopped?

Or did you mean impossible? wink

i said inevitable

[quotef8fff4f956="akalic"]i said inevitable[/quotef8fff4f956]

I know what you said. It makes no sense.

[quotef8fff4f956]Its inevitable to stop all different types of perceptions around the world because we'll never agree completely..[/quotef8fff4f956]

What you're saying is that it's guaranteed that all different types of perceptions will be stopped, therefore it's guaranteed that everyone will think or feel the same way.

If you change the word "inevitable" to "impossible" then it makes sense.