big scam that I havent seen addressed.

[bd185182e5c]Ok this is happening alot[/bd185182e5c]. The one scam That I personally have seen alot of is the traders that agree to a site for site trade and then come back and say oh I cant do your site but I will gladly pay you 20.00 for your green. This is a scam as surly as stealing $20.00 from you. If you enter into a trade for green for green on comparible sites then you should be compisated what you agreed upon. Example I set up a trade green for green. I went green right away. The other trader has yet to go green. Its been over a week. My site, a green is valued at $40.00. His site the green is valued at $40.00. If you accept the terms of this trade and cant do your part then I belive you owe not the $20.00 you pay for sites but the $40.00 you agreed on. The reason Im bringing this up is that I had a friend and he wanted to do site for site trades. Well he got alot of offers and went green for all of them. When it came time for them to go green they came back and said I cant do it but will pay you $20.00. Some of them didnt even bother to sign up on his sites and some that did didnt click any offers. This is a scam and needs to be addressed as such. (Fred) P.S. I have several names of traders that are doing this to my friend. We are trying to comunicate with them now. Some wont even answear his pms. others say I put in a support ticket and it takes along time. We contacted the sites and no ticket has been put in. We will give it one week and then post all the names. You know who you are so lets communicate.

Hear, hear !!!

Here's a hint people [be161e55b95]Lying and/or deliberately misleading someone is also known as a con - a.k.a. SCAMMING!!! [/be161e55b95]

I totally agree!!!

People need to be serious about their decision on doing a trade. I know sometimes things happen...but I always check out the offers page first and make sure I am able to complete the offer.

I have actually had a few people that I have had to do this to, so as much as I agree that some people are doing it as a scam, I also believe that sometimes you just can't help it. I can look at the offer list, and I always make sure there are double the amount of offers available to me that are required for a green. But sometimes when I get signed in, the offer links are dead, or just outrageous to the point that I refuse to do the (I'm not paying $179 for an offer to go green on a $40/ref site). So, again, I agree with you!!! If there weren't any offers even clicked on and people are blatantly lying to their trading partners, THAT'S HORRIBLE!!! But SOMETIMES, it is a legitimate thing to do!

[quote511d25ac1b="csullivan1@rochester.rr.c"]I have actually had a few people that I have had to do this to, so as much as I agree that some people are doing it as a scam, I also believe that sometimes you just can't help it. I can look at the offer list, and I always make sure there are double the amount of offers available to me that are required for a green. But sometimes when I get signed in, the offer links are dead, or just outrageous to the point that I refuse to do the (I'm not paying $179 for an offer to go green on a $40/ref site). So, again, I agree with you!!! If there weren't any offers even clicked on and people are blatantly lying to their trading partners, THAT'S HORRIBLE!!! But SOMETIMES, it is a legitimate thing to do![/quote511d25ac1b] But to be honest, dont you also agree that you benitited $40.00 For thier green? Why should it now be ok to pay them $20.00? It cost them to do offers for you also. Why should you make the $20.00 becaules you couldent do the site. No matter what the reaon.

[quotedaa5fde73f="gator1002"][quotedaa5fde73f="csullivan1@rochester.rr.c"]I have actually had a few people that I have had to do this to, so as much as I agree that some people are doing it as a scam, I also believe that sometimes you just can't help it. I can look at the offer list, and I always make sure there are double the amount of offers available to me that are required for a green. But sometimes when I get signed in, the offer links are dead, or just outrageous to the point that I refuse to do the (I'm not paying $179 for an offer to go green on a $40/ref site). So, again, I agree with you!!! If there weren't any offers even clicked on and people are blatantly lying to their trading partners, THAT'S HORRIBLE!!! But SOMETIMES, it is a legitimate thing to do![/quotedaa5fde73f] But to be honest, dont you also agree that you benitited $40.00 For thier green? Why should it now be ok to pay them $20.00? It cost them to do offers for you also. Why should you make the $20.00 becaules you couldent do the site. No matter what the reaon.[/quotedaa5fde73f]

I agree. Since the opening trade agreement was originally ref for ref, there's no real excuse for changing it just b/c you ended up not being able to fulfill your end of the bargain. Instead, the profit margin that they would have had if you had been their ref should be compensated for if you can only pay them cash.

first

with your tr as close as it is to 100 you should never put yourself in a situation where you will have to complete a site first. Just be patient there is no rush. Ive thought about trading with a higher tr user but decided against it since I wouldnt want to put myself in a possible waiting situation even though I trusted the higher tr user

second

your solution for the other user compensating you $40 is ridiculous. A normal price for your referral is $20-25 on the trade board. If the user is unable to finish your site then that is the current market value of your referral.

third

if a user is specifically lying

a) about completing an offer but has no offers clicked then that user should be considered a scammer.
b) about submitting a support ticket but has not should be contacted asap and have the situation resolved.

fourth

in our trade.

Ive completed the offers and have submitted a missing credit report. the site says sent to affiliate for both tickets I created. You can check up with the OGf people if you want.

BTW you may say this is for other users and my name wasn't going to be mentioned and what not. This just preemptive as I dont want to see my name brought up in this thread.

[quote35ea05c46a]second

your solution for the other user compensating you $40 is ridiculous. A normal price for your referral is $20-25 on the trade board. If the user is unable to finish your site then that is the current market value of your referral. [/quote35ea05c46a]

100% agreed!!!

I agree. Since the opening trade agreement was originally ref for ref, there's no real excuse for changing it just b/c you ended up not being able to fulfill your end of the bargain. Instead, the profit margin that they would have had if you had been their ref should be compensated for if you can only pay them cash.

I take your side. IT is not OK to overpromise and then underdeliver. If a trader really cannot deliver a green then that trader does owe that person the full value dollar of what of the green that was not completed.

+Karma for gator1002

How about a middle of the road settlement? For instance, if a green is worth $40, and the trader who could not complete the site usually offers $20 for a green, why not make it $30?

I think having to pay the full value is a bit excessive, but I agree there should be some penalty involved to serve as discouragement from traders taking advantage of the system - agreeing to trades and then the OMG "I can't do the site now".

Sometimes it can't be helped - if you've done all the offers you can do (i.e. ones you were planning on doing are dead/unavailable/whatever), doing an offer twice or doing something you have no interest in (fraud) is only going to make the green you're trying to give them red and reds of course do no one any good. If a trader has had to back out more than once or twice per 100 trades in this fashion, however, then I would def smell a rat and avoid them going forward.

Yes this has been happening quite a bit lately. I do green 4 green trades quite a bit. I always make a stipulation in my trades. That being If any one party in the trade can not go green on the other party's site full payment of the value of the referral should be paid. So if it is a $40 per referral site a payment of $40 should be made. People need to check out the sites that they potentially are going to go green on before committing to any trade.

[quote063bba2aa3="csullivan1@rochester.rr.c"][quote063bba2aa3]second

your solution for the other user compensating you $40 is ridiculous. A normal price for your referral is $20-25 on the trade board. If the user is unable to finish your site then that is the current market value of your referral. [/quote063bba2aa3]

100% agreed!!![/quote063bba2aa3]

No. Let me give you an example. You are newbie who is doing a site that will give you $200 for 5 refs. For whatever reason, you can only do 5 offers. So I say that I have 5 friends willing to do that site if you do my sites. Since you have lower TR, you go first and do all my sites (each paying $40/ref). In that trade, I made $200. Then, I say that all five friends backed out and say "oh the market value is only $20" and give you $100. In the end, you got screwed out of $100, and I got away with $100 profit. Since everyone knows that green for green trades are common, I used little to no time in finishing the site, and ended paying much less than I usually do.

When you don't stick to your trade, you need to pay extra for the time wasted. I believe that it should be $45-50 ($5-$10 above referral value) for backing out of a green for green trade (if the other person already went green).

you cant bring potential income into this. If any user goes into 5 trades with a newb and backs out of all 5 trades he will be banned and will have little excuse.

now I think most of you are confused on the issue at hand

1. this issue doesnt apply in the scenario the user deliberately lies about signing up and completing offers but the site itself says there has not even been any click history. In this scenario the user should be banned for falsely leading another user.

2. in the scenario the user does have a click history and has submitted a support ticket for it then the user should have these options.

a)either finish the site with other offers
b)settle with a market value paypal rate for the referral.
c)be allowed to wait the appropriate length of time required for a misssing credit report's decision.(OGF says 'Manual credits can take anywhere from 1 week to 2 months to be reviewed')

You can not bring future potential earnings into this debate, especially in case 2 where the user did follow through with completing the offers but for whatever reason his/her offers were not approved. Again this is different in scenario 1 as that user deserves an immediate ban.

[quotefe39aa6198="good2speed"]you cant bring potential income into this. If any user goes into 5 trades with a newb and backs out of all 5 trades he will be banned and will have little excuse.

[bfe39aa6198] Seen it done plenty of times with no ban[/bfe39aa6198]

now I think most of you are confused on the issue at hand

1. this issue doesnt apply in the scenario the user deliberately lies about signing up and completing offers but the site itself says there has not even been any click history. In this scenario the user should be banned for falsely leading another user.

[bfe39aa6198] How can you tell whether he did it deliberately or not? If I do it right now, I would probably be able to get away with it since I have not done anything like this before. [/bfe39aa6198]

2. in the scenario the user does have a click history and has submitted a support ticket for it then the user should have these options.

[bfe39aa6198] Click history does not mean anything when you say that "your friend" will be doing the site, and then at the last minute he backs out. In addition, it is not difficult to create an account, click random offers, and say you can't find anything to do. [/bfe39aa6198]

a)either finish the site with other offers
b)settle with a market value paypal rate for the referral.
c)be allowed to wait the appropriate length of time required for a misssing credit report's decision.(OGF says 'Manual credits can take anywhere from 1 week to 2 months to be reviewed')

[bfe39aa6198] Obviously the person doesn't plan to do A. B would be his course of action. If the guy never did an offer then that would be void/ [/bfe39aa6198]

You can not bring future potential earnings into this debate, especially in case 2 where the user did follow through with completing the offers but for whatever reason his/her offers were not approved. Again this is different in scenario 1 as that user deserves an immediate ban.

[bfe39aa6198] It is much different when a site owner fails to get manual credit for a person and when a person's "friend" does not even sign up. I value a green for $40, not $20/30/39. It should not depend on [ife39aa6198]market value[/ife39aa6198], but on the ref/pay ratio. Immediate bans don't go out that often. It isn't hard to make up a story "Oh, I had five friends but they all backed out so it isn't by fault" and get away with it by paying $20/ref. Finally, there is currently NO market value seeing as you cannot immediately get a ref for an x amount.[/bfe39aa6198]

[/quotefe39aa6198]

Just a last thing on this. I dont make my living doing freebi sites. Its a hobby I enjoy. When I do a trade I try to make a profit of $10.00 so If Im to make $40.00 that your green would be worth to me, I look for offers that are $30.00 or less. If I do a ref. for $20.00 cash I look for offers that or $10.00 or less. If we had a site for site trade set up and the refs. were worth $40.00 I feel free to look at all offers that are in the $30.00 range so a payment of $20.00 at this point is a loss of $10.00 to me and a profit to you. Any way you cut it thats not a fair trade.Now I do admit that this opens up the list of things that I recieve from the offers, that I want and can use. But if I recieved the same product away from the forum the co. normally has discounts that we dont get here.

I think that this problem will become more of an issue now with the No Manual Credit policy that has come in to play as of today. If I go into a trade because I see 5 offers I can choose from, but when I go to do them, 2 don't work and the others don't credit, then I don't have any other recourse.

My suggestion would be to spell out all of the options at the beginning (in the trade module) very clearly, so that this case is addressed.

laurel

just a note. good2speed settled his trade with me for $20.00. He on the other hand has a $40.00 referal from me. I wont trade with this person again. After greening instantly on his site and getting nothing but problems from him after, this is the kind of feedback he leaves. XXXXX Dont trade with this guy he is bad news!!!!! Very untrustworthy. Definetely avoid!!!!!! XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

they got nerve..we know your a great trader!!!! dont worry about them

[quote4f875961a8="gator1002"]just a note. good2speed settled his trade with me for $20.00. He on the other hand has a $40.00 referal from me. I wont trade with this person again. After greening instantly on his site and getting nothing but problems from him after, this is the kind of feedback he leaves. XXXXX Dont trade with this guy he is bad news!!!!! Very untrustworthy. Definetely avoid!!!!!! XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX[/quote4f875961a8]

Now I get to tear you apart.. ) and oh ya I didnt settle, you did.

ok do you know how to spell compensate? Are you 50+ years old? What the fuck? Also thats not how you spell comparable.

[quote4f875961a8="gator1002"]If you enter into a trade for green for green on comparible sites then you should be [b4f875961a8]compisated[/b4f875961a8] what you agreed upon[/quote4f875961a8]

I mean thats not even close. You do know there is a letter N in the word?

Ok now. All I said was that you were untrustworthy and I believe it to be true. Trust goes both ways and you gave me none. I did your site and did 3 offers. I sent you an IM conversation I had with Bonnie and you couldnt even wait a week before asking me to do another site. Granted the prohibition of the MCR's may favor your argument but its too bad we started this trade even before any knowledge of MCR's not being accepted.

So basically you couldnt trust me for even a week before you created this thread and that is why I find you untrustworthy. You decided to give me no trust and tried to drag me through the dirt and for that reason I felt no obligation to find someone who could. I couldve been able to find a referral for you by searching around but decided why bother since you instilled no faith in me. Figured Id just pay you and get it over with.

My feedback is my honest opinion of you. I may have left a more favorable feedback if you did. After seeing what you had to write I decided to throw cordial out the window and express my real feelings.

[quote4f875961a8="gator1002"]
The reason Im bringing this up is that I had a friend and he wanted to do site for site trades. Well he got alot of offers and went green for all of them. When it came time for them to go green they came back and said I cant do it but will pay you $20.00. Some of them didnt even bother to sign up on his sites and some that did didnt click any offers. This is a scam and needs to be addressed as such. (Fred) [b4f875961a8]P.S. I have several names of traders that are doing this to my friend.[/b4f875961a8] [/quote4f875961a8]

BTW who are your other traders that wouldnt complete your friend sites or was it just me from the start?

I didnt start this thread with you in mind but you decided to make it about you. Should I go back to our pms and post all your typos here? No I dont think I will Im to mature for that. And to bring up a coulple of miss spelled words? You think that gives me a hard time? Son you have a lot of growing up to do.

[quotefcdf6767ff="gator1002"]I didnt start this thread with you in mind [/quotefcdf6767ff]

yes you did.

[quotefcdf6767ff="gator1002"]but you decided to make it about you. [/quotefcdf6767ff]

I decided to clarify a situation which pertained to me. Never did I try to make it about me.

[quotefcdf6767ff="gator1002"]Should I go back to our pms and post all your typos here?[/quotefcdf6767ff]

knock yourself out and you still wont find any words misspelled as badly misspelled as 'compisate'. In fact I think you had no idea there was an N in the word before I pointed it out.

[quotefcdf6767ff="gator1002"]
No I dont think I will Im to mature for that. And to bring up a coulple of [bfcdf6767ff]miss spelled[/bfcdf6767ff] words?[/quotefcdf6767ff]

love your 'miss spelled' words also lol.

Is that your response for my whole argument above? I suppose you dont have to argue whether or not you are trustworthy. I mean 3 days is all it took for you to ask me to try another site. Did you not plan on letting me wait till my manuals credited? Seems like you didn't trust me and if you can't trust me why should I trust you.

[quotefcdf6767ff="gator1002"]
You think that gives me a hard time? Son you have a lot of growing up to do.[/quotefcdf6767ff]

Yes I do. I think you do feel quite oops.

man are we dealing with kids here or adults. i cant believe we are having this kind of argument here and on and on it goes, like a bunch of brats. good luck on settling this.

Hi there,

Don't want to get stuck in the middle of anything here, but I know gator (Fred) enough to know he is an intelligent man, and a few typo's do not make a person a poor trader.

I don't always use spell check, and type rather quickly with some long daggers, so go back and edit if I catch something ridiculous, but am sure I miss quite a few....that has nothing to do with my trading status.

Hopefully you two will either just let this drop, or work it out like 2 respected traders should. I know that certain people were involved, but originally the thread was about green for green trades and what a trader should rightfully owe if unable to follow through on their end, as well as it being a possible scam to offer half of what the referral was worth.

Good luck To you both!

Margot wink

[b81dafcfdda](edited)[/b81dafcfdda]

I decided to go check Gator's TR comments, as you stated all you said was that he was untrustworthy; this is a quote from you on his record. States much more than "he's untrustworthy."

It's there for any and all to see. And guess what? Dont has an apostrophe, and definetely is definitely not spelled like that! LMAO

XXXXX Dont trade with this guy he is bad news!!!!! Very untrustworthy. Definetely avoid!!!!!! XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

Now you've turned me into a little kid. roll Isn't there a saying some where about pulling a plank out of your own eye before trying to remove the sliver from anothers? wink

i didnt read the whole thread but...
when this happened ONCE to me I offerred the average of the payments being offered on this site. the trader was agreeable.
since then I have ALWAYS asked for an offer list.
that one time another solution would have been for me to pay someone to green for the other user