An experience with a ref who went RED

Live forum: http://forum.freeipodguide.com/viewtopic.php?t=64035

skepticalcynic

08-06-2007 16:12:51

I wanted to tell about a recent experience to help alleviate some unnecessary mud-slinging...

I recently had a ref who went on hold on 2 of my sites on the same network. He PMed me immediately when he found out and apologized. He explained that the reason he was on hold was because some of his refs for one site had done similar offers and so they accused him of doing "walkthroughs". He did not do that. His main point was that telling the refs NOT to do certain offers would also be walking them through.

He was very discouraged and frustrated. I'm sure many of us would be too. And since I had paid him upfront, he was concerned about how I would react and what the possible ramifications would be.

Because of his extremely frequent and clear communications to me keeping me posted on his progress throughout the trade, I had no doubt in my mind that he is an honest trader. In fact, I felt bad that he was having a bad experience with this freebie network and was beginning to doubt the whole system. I told him he should discuss the issue with the site and see if he could get it sorted out and then to let me know the result.

This morning, I had a couple of PMs waiting for me letting me know that he had had lengthy conversations with the site owner and was able to get the whole mess cleared up. Which is great - he's now green again and is feeling better about not just this network, but the freebie thing overall.

There are many people in this forum who would not have shown the patience and good faith to give a red ref time to work things out and clear up misunderstandings with a site owner. Instead, they would have immediately posted in this forum "so-and-so is red on such-and-such site".

At that point, even if a ref can clear themselves of suspiscion on a site, the damage to that trader's reputation has been done and cannot be easily fixed, if at all. Especially if the trader has been here only a short time or has a lower TR. So for all practical purposes, that person is "blacklisted" and will not have a fair chance to rebuild a decent reputation and become successful.

This is exactly why the rules state
[quote12b3e5f34e]DONíT make a scammer thread about someone unless you have exhausted every possible means of communication between you and the other member, have waited the required amount of time to get credit or for the other member to get credit, have contacted a Mod and STILL have not received a response from the other member and/or a green or paypal, depending on the details of your trade.[/quote12b3e5f34e]

It is unfair and not nice to ruin a person chances of success based on partial information or knee-jerk reactions. Please think carefully before making accusations or even posting about a "red" ref. Consider these questions
"Have I given the person ample opportunity to explain themselves to me?"
"Have I given them the opportunity to appeal to the site and clear up the problem?"
"Does the site have specific and reasonable grounds for their final decision?"
"Have I given the person time and opportunity to make things right by paying me back, finding me a different ref, etc?"
"If I were this person, would I consider it fair to be posted as a scammer?"

Once you've thought about these things, then would be the time to PM a moderator if you still think you have been outright and intentionally scammed. The moderator will look into it and then give you their opinion. They will also advise you whether or not to make a post in the scammers section.

Please, please think carefully before you cast a shadow on the reputation of a fellow trader! None of us would ever want that to happen to us. So the least we can do is make absolutely certain before we type that person's name in this forum.

Take it for whatever it's worth...

tinkerjenn

08-06-2007 16:32:57

I agree 100%

I had a ref go red on me not too long ago. I pm'ed both the trader and a mod. I did NOT post here. Within hours the problem was solved and ther was no need to drag his person through the mud.

theman2005

08-06-2007 16:35:43

Wow, that's wonderfully said.

Definately a good thing to keep in mind.

Not all traders that go red are scammers. Given time and circumstances, misunderstandings can be worked out one way or another.

In the worst case scenario, there are also those "real" scammers, so based on asking yourself those questions she mentioned above, if you answered "YES" to most of them, then that person theoretically is a scammer.

+Karma for a very informative post!

weebles_five

08-06-2007 17:08:54

I agree totally!! Very well put. Treat everyone else the way you would like to be treated. With respect.

Denise07

08-06-2007 20:29:43

Well said and I couldn't agree more. Good questions to ask yourself before you jump to conclusions. Anyone can make an honest mistake. As my sig says Treat people as you would want to be treated

aviendha47

08-06-2007 20:35:00

Nice of you to put that out there and very well at that.

csullivan1@rochester.rr.c

08-06-2007 20:38:17

Plus KARMA

Big War Bird

09-06-2007 04:24:57

See I told you that you are very nice and helpful!

Jenne1975

09-06-2007 12:36:50

Very nice! Well done. I also have had two people go red on me. Kept my mouth shut. I did warn people I like. If they did a trade with the same person. Just to keep eachother informed. But both times it was just newbie mistakes. Like my one red I got. shock I hit the button twice by accident. D OPPS! But I got it taken care of right away. This place is a great trading environment. Just gotta be weary of the scammers. Which so far I havent found any or they havent found me. "knock on wood" hehe. Laterzzz!

maksmom

09-06-2007 16:58:38

Absolutely true! I've been lucky in that only a couple of people have gone red on my sites, but they were honest mistakes and resolved amicably. I have contacted mods on a few occasions about other traders, and again, resolved amicably. Posting in the scammer section should truly be the last resort. It's really too bad that the few "true" scammers out there ruin it for the honest traders who make mistakes. It's remarkably easy to make mistakes in the freebie world (even when you've read the rules over and over) and everyone should be given time to sort them out before being labeled a scammer, so skepticalcynic, good post!!

jcasebmw

11-06-2007 14:48:30

Some1 just went red on cash.zeropricetags. Not gonna say the name cuz I am in the middle of working it out. It just wastes a bunch of time tho. (

skepticalcynic

11-06-2007 20:43:23

You're right - it wastes a LOT of time - especially the part where you have to wait a week or 2 to see if they even bother to read your PM. I had one of my refs who isn't red, but who has had his credits reduced on a site - I PMed him over a week ago and he hasn't even read it. That's $42 down the drain ( I guess I should have stuck by my "pay on approval rule" - that's twice now I've gone against it, and twice I've been scammed...[/color2e8ed36564]

I find that in general [i2e8ed36564][b2e8ed36564]honest traders stay in frequent communication[/size2e8ed36564][/color2e8ed36564] [/b2e8ed36564][/i2e8ed36564]always, but [i2e8ed36564][b2e8ed36564]especially[/b2e8ed36564][/i2e8ed36564] when there is a problem...

gator1002

13-06-2007 07:18:50

This is all true. I have had many many reds. Only 3 that were indeed scammers. Most as you said were newbi mistakes and were worked out. The one scam That I personally have seen alot of is the traders that agree to a site for site trade and then come back and say oh I cant do your site but I will gladly pay you 20.00 for your green. This is a scam as surly as stealing $20.00 from you. If you enter into a trade for green for green on comparible sites then you should be compisated what you agreed upon. Example I set up a trade green for green. I went green right away. The other trader has yet to go green. Its been over a week. My site, a green is valued at $40.00. His site the green is valued at $40.00. If you accept the terms of this trade and cant do your part then I belive you owe not the $20.00 you pay for sites but the $40.00 you agreed on. The reason Im bringing this up is that I had a friend and he wanted to do site for site trades. Well he got alot of offers and went green for all of them. When it came time for them to go green they came back and said I cant do it but will pay you $20.00. Some of them didnt even bother to sign up on his sites and some that did didnt click any offers. This is a scam and needs to be addressed as such. (Fred)

Yesitsfree4you

15-06-2007 18:16:58

I'm wondering how long is long enough to wait for a response? I had a referral go on hold and I had paid a very good amount of money for this green.
I pm'd the referral and they read the pm on Wed. evening. It is now Friday evening and no response from them. I let them know that if I don't get a reply by Saturday, I'll pm a moderator.
I've already had to do this before, with someone else that went on hold because when I pm'd them, they wouldn't try to work anything out with me, until I pm'd a moderator. Finally after them having their account suspended, they refunded my money. Very frustrating to have to get a moderator involved.

ILoveToys

15-06-2007 19:07:49

I'm not going to praise that idea at all. In fact it's the worst thing you can do is to wait to post here. If you post here and alert ppl there MAY be a problem, then they know to see how it comes out.

I went red for a guy on A4F once, and it was posted about before I knew I was red even, but all I had to do is go in there and say, "Hey, sorry i'm red, I'm going to get this figured out w/ the site or I'll reimburse you if I can't get rid of the red."

As the person who went red, I owe it to everyone to keep them updated on my progress. If someone goes red, is posted about in here, and won't respond, that is a sign of a scammer.

I have no problem giving a person some time, but I will always post here immediately if someone goes red on me; not to "ruin their rep", but to alert everyone else who might be trading w/ them that that there is some issue that needs to be resolved. TBH seeing someone resolve a red gives me more confidence than if they've never had an issue, because I know if something comes up they'll make it right.

gambit00x

16-06-2007 00:58:52

Good point ILT--
Scammers don't tend to do much posting; before or after being suspected.

gator1002

16-06-2007 08:07:27

What happened to the rule of 14 days without contact. Dont we still need to pm them at least once every 7 days? then if no contact pm a mod. Then if that fails, post here? Have I been resolving the issues wrong? 90% of the reds that I have recieved have been resolved this way.

aviendha47

16-06-2007 14:01:19

[quotef33246db91="gator1002"]What happened to the rule of 14 days without contact. Dont we still need to pm them at least once every 7 days? then if no contact pm a mod. Then if that fails, post here? Have I been resolving the issues wrong? 90% of the reds that I have recieved have been resolved this way.[/quotef33246db91]

I've been operating under the same assumption with good results. No scammers for me.

skepticalcynic

17-06-2007 19:03:54

[quote05b90dd8a1]DONíT make a scammer thread about someone unless you have exhausted every possible means of communication between you and the other member, have waited the required amount of time to get credit or for the other member to get credit, have contacted a Mod and STILL have not received a response from the other member and/or a green or paypal, depending on the details of your trade.
(-FiPG rules)
[/quote05b90dd8a1]

[quote05b90dd8a1="KeithA"]Don't open a thread here unless you've PMed a moderator.

If a moderator doesn't reply for 48 hours, PM another one. You can post after 48 hours if the matter is urgent.
[/quote05b90dd8a1]

gator1002

18-06-2007 05:28:11

Im sure is a well deserved vacation. By the time you get back maybe all this mess will make sence again. Will miss you while your gone (Fred)