I'm thinking about getting the iBook and switching to mac...

Can anyone tell me the pros and cons about it. I'll love to hear what you guys think about it. I'm gonna have to learn the mac OS, any suggestions?

Thanks

Con Most commercial software is made for PCs, with Mac support lagging months behind, if present at all. Especially games.

Pros Umm. You get to be in the Cool Hip Mac Crowd, which is fun.

Really, unless you want to look cool, there's no truly valid reason to actually 100% switch to Apple products...especially if you have a lot of software and hardware for windows-based machines.

Windows XP is plenty stable, and if you're not a moron and don't constantly download shit that infects your computer with adware/spyware/malware, an XP-based machine will work just fine.

If you really want to find out if you like OS X, go download PearPC (www.pearpc.net) and get a copy of Panther. It's a PowerPC emulator for Windows - I've been using it, and have discovered that I like OS X for the visuals and the ease of configuration, but I would never switch entirely. It's just not worth it, because I have a huge repository of Windows-based software that I use on a daily basis.

The only reason (IMO) to get a Mac is that the iBook is free. You could always get the cash, and then go buy a PowerBook for $400 more - there are enough upgrades to make it worth the money.

Well, what's a good pc notebook around $1000 or a little bit more? What brand and what model?

HP?
Sony?
Dell?

I have a Compaq Presario R3000 AMD 64 its fucking great with a 15.4" widescreen...with a nvidia graphics card. From what i hear is a good gaming card, im not a gamer. all though it was able to handle Call of duty ( the new i dont rember the name) but yeah i love my laptop.

Oh its like $1600 but i think its cheaper now maybe like 1300 with rebates.

I always push the Dell Latitude line through Small Business...

They are generally over $1000 by a few hundred dollars, but they're well-built and run better than other brands. They're also smaller/lighters/easier to handle than, say, what Compaq, eMachines, and HP tend to sell.

I used to like windows, but now I am proud to say I will never run a microsoft product again. I switched to Linux a few months ago and I havn't looked back. After the switch, I can't understand how normal people can justify using windows. I found myself reformatting my machine about every six months just to keep it running at a satisfactory speed (even without malware, spyware and viruses windows has a half life of about six months of daily usage). I do alot of computer work including repairs and upgrades, and I can't tell you how many times I have gotten paid insane amounts of $$ to fix and reformat a windows computer. With platforms like OS X and Linux there are no extra maintenance costs (especially with Linux because you can't beat free).

Some may argue that people have to stick to windows if they want to be able to be a part of the computer experience (althought not true, a testament to Microsoft's monopoly, which I am extreamly opposed to). Since I have been using Linux, I have had no trouble doing everything I did on my windows computer, including

Word Proscessing (OpenOffice.org is a great office suite, with Word, Powerpoint, Excel backwards compatability)
Email (I never used Outlook, thunderbird is the shit)
Graphic Editing (The Gimp or Photoshop)
Using my iPod (gtkpod or iTunes)
Playing Games (I've got Half Life 2 running perfectly ))
Using perhiperals (scanner, usb drives, everything works fine)
More that I can't think about listing right now

If you use windows, you are paying for the license which is around $200, plus if you are using the office suite (which I would not reccomend, even if you are running windows save yourself some $$ and get openoffice) then that is another $500.

So in addition to buying a computer, you have paid $700 for the operating system and office suite, I have paid $0.

All that may be good, but the deciding factor for me to switch over was the non-existance of malware, spyware and viri. Although I am very good at staying away from viri and the like (I hadn't had a virus in 5 years) I don't like having an unsafe computer. Running programs like norton (another $150) slows down the computer so much that I couldn't justify it if it was free.

Spyware is unavoidable. I don't use Internet explorer, yet I still got tons of spyware, and had to run ad-aware and spybot on a weekly basis.

Linux is for everyone, there are distros for the new user (Suse, Linspire, Mandrake, Ubuntu) and distros for the more experienced user (Debian, Slackware, FreeBSD - yes I know it's not Linux, but it's still sweet).

Although people like shifuimam may claim that windows is a fantastic OS with no problems, this is just not the case. Go with a Mac and you won't be dissapointed.

that last post was by me, I'm not sure why it came through as guest.

I wanted to add this first, in case everything else was tl;dr.

[quote42be704115="yunier2002"]Can anyone tell me the pros and cons about it. I'll love to hear what you guys think about it. I'm gonna have to learn the mac OS, any suggestions?

Thanks[/quote42be704115]

Yunier, it's a free laptop. If I were you, I'd take the cash and buy a 12" PowerBook, preferably with the Mac educational discount (there's a 99% chance your school is eligible). It's about $400 more, but the upgrades make it more than worth it. If you DO go with the iBook, though, it's not a bad machine. Seeing as it's free, and it retails for $999, it's like any of the other free stuff - IT'S FREE. If you want to get into Macs, this is the best time to do it, although you might want to work towards a Mini Mac first, since they take only 10 referrals.

Moving on to my rebuttal for mister Linux-is-god...

----------------------------------------------------------------

Interesting...

I guess it's all in the software you use, the application of your computer, and what network you're on.

I'm running Windows XP/Pro SP2 on four machines at my house. Three of them are managed by me; one was bought before I moved in with my dad and stepmom. That computer is falling apart and desperately needs to be reformatted.

The others, however...I've been able to run XP for more than a year without needing to reformat. This is in comparison to my old Windows 95/98se machine that had to finally be reverted to Windows 95 because 98 required a reformat monthly.

I got Office Pro Enterprise 2003 and Symantec Corporate 9.x for free through my school, so no issue there.

It really depends on the person. A good number of computer users out there aren't comfortable enough with Linux to try and install it on their machines. My boyfriend has been running XP/Pro SP1 for several years now one one of his computers and has never needed to do a reformat.

I don't just make blind claims about XP. The fact is, it is a stable operating system and will more than suffice for a basic computer user. It's NOT a good idea to switch to Mac if you've never used one before and have no access to software for said operating system. Hardware and software for Mac-based systems costs more, and the initial price of the computer is astronomical compared to what's available in the Windows world.

I know people who bought Macs because someone told them to, and they didn't even know how to do basic things like open the CD-ROM, log off, or use the right-click/context menus. For people like that, a Mac IS a disappointment, especially when they need help (because they're already relatively computer-illiterate) and nobody can help them because everybody else uses XP.

Don't get me wrong; I like OS X. I run PearPC fairly regularly now, and I know enough about the operating system to find my way around without needing assistance. Linux is not bad, but unless you're a programmer, there is little valid reason to switch entirely to Linux. I use far too many Windows-based applications to be able to afford the time wasted in trying to switch to a different operating system and different software. Many people will find themselves in the same situation...especially those in school.

It is 100% a matter of personal preference and opinion. Some people find that Linux is the only way to go. Others find that they like having a Linux-based firewall or file server, but use Windows for their personal computing needs. Some, like me, avoid Linux but want to get into Macs purely for fun. Some people use Macs and nothing but Macs, but for the average Windows user who knows little more than how to use Word and Internet Explorer, OS X isn't necessarily the best option.

You can't make a blanket assumption that one operating system is 100% superior to any other. I used to do that myself, and pretty much said "Macs suck" whenever anyone brought up Mac OS or any of their hardware. I don't think that Macs suck, but I also don't think that Windows is some piece of shit that needs to be squashed forevermore. Every operating system has its flaws.

P.S. and while you say that spyware is unavoidable, I have yet to get infected with anything that I didn't knowingly put on my machine. If you stay away from "free" software downloaded off the internet, and stay away from shitty pseudo-search websites that auto-download things to your computer, you more than likely won't have a problem with adware, malware, spyware, and the like.

I'm not saying that it's not a matter of personal opinion, I'm just saying that I can't understand how people would willingly use the operating system that virtually all spyware, malware and virisus are written for. I prefer a more stable (Windows is unstable by design, when a program crashes it locks up system modules that are needed for the system to run, and it brings down the entire system, with linux, only that one program is brought down, and the rest of the system works just fine) and a more secure system.

I'm not saying all of these things about windows out of ignorance, I was a huge windows promoter just a few years ago, and although I liked Linux (I was dual-booting at the time) I hated macOS and OS X. Windows itself turned me off of Windows.

[quotef2b2e2b0c9="Phossil"](Windows is unstable by design, when a program crashes it locks up system modules that are needed for the system to run, and it brings down the entire system, with linux, only that one program is brought down, and the rest of the system works just fine)[/quotef2b2e2b0c9]

I take it you've had little experience with XP. This is NOT the case with XP at all. When a program crashes, only that program crashes. Fuck; even if explorer.exe shits itself for some reason, the rest of your applications are still running, and all you have to do is ctrl+alt+del, go to the run prompt, and type "explorer". XP is far more stable than what you claim, which makes me think you've either never used it or only used it at public terminals at the library or something.

Check your facts before you start blasting an operating system. It [bf2b2e2b0c9]is[/bf2b2e2b0c9] a matter of opinion, regardless of how superior you think your computer is to the rest of the machines in the world.

Bottom line, Linux is not for everyone. Windows is not for everyone. I think I'm going to start running Solaris on all my machines and post long tirades about how Solaris is better than any other O/S on the planet.

The reason most virii, spyware, etc are written for windows is because it is the most common OS. If Linux managed to become the most pervelant, then they would be written for Linux.

As for why I use Windows over Linux? Because I use my computer mostly for recreation, and since I can't run things like Everquest, City of Heroes, or other games under linux, it's pretty much worthless to me.

In the end, most software is written for Windows. That is why I am not a Mac user, or a Linux user.

spend the extra 100$ and get enough memory to run your apps and you hardly ever have problems with anything in XP.

I have 2gig of ram and i cant remember the last time a program crashed due to a windows problem. Tweaking video options etc is another story tho.

its amazing how far this thread has gone off topic....

lol back to topic, I think I'm gonna stick with Windows at least for now. I'll probably get the $1000 and put some extra to get an IBM or DELL laptop. Maybe Dell since it's cheaper )

I have actully had quite a bit of experience with XP - I exclusivly used XP from it's release in (what was it 2001?) until about a year ago, when I started dual booting, and I finally switched completely a few months ago. My claims about it's instability are true, I am talking about the actual build of the OS, how it is organized. Thats why Linux can keep running for months on end without a reboot, while windows needs to reboot much more often.

Mistwolf - your claim that if Linux was the most widely used operating system it would have more viruses is true - but the fact of the matter is, Linux by design is more secure than windows as well (not all forms of linux, but OSX - a unix - was named the most stable operating system ever. Even if more viruses were written for Linux, because Linux is Open-Source, the the code is looked over hundreds of times by regular people and hobbiests who release patches to security holes. Because the code is being looked over by hundreds if not thosands of people daily, patches are released much quicker than when managed by a large corperation.

Games can run under Linux, like I said, I've got Half Life 2 running perfectly, and everquest and city of hero's both run - check out www.transgaming.com for more info on that if you are at all interested.

I'm not in any way saying "My computer is better than yours" There is no aspect of that. I just can't understnad why there isn't some mass exodus away from windows, why people don't leave an OS that is so plauged and sceptible to malitious code.

There was an article on Slashdot not too long ago that I think made some excellent points about OSX verses Windows - but keep in mind, with Linux you can run the majority of windows programs (Right now I run Half Life 2, QuickPAR, WinRAR, Quiktime, iTunes, The Rosetta Stone, and yes, unfortunatly Internet Explorer as alot of college applications are made to interface with it and I don't want my data screwed up.

I couldn't find the slashdot article, but it's not all that old, if anyone feels like looking for it it's worth a read.

Hon, can you just let it go that not everyone is slave to Linux the way that you are? Everyone is slave to one operating system or another, and it doesn't make someone like mistwolf any less of a person or computer user simply because they don't use Linux.

PLEASE, for the sake of the rest of us, get over this superiorty complex you have. It's just an operating system - it's not the end of the world.

There isn't a "mass exodus" away from windows because people are familiar with windows, have software they KNOW will work with it, and have no actual valid reason to use a different OS. Every computer you buy that isn't from Apple comes preloaded with XP, so why change? Yes, I know there is the Lindows movement, but to the general public, what they get is preloaded with XP Home. Most of the people who go to the store to buy a computer know so little about the technical stuff and the advanced usage that it would make no sense for them to try and get Linux up and running.

Boohoo. So not everyone uses Linux. Like I said, it doesn't make you some kind of better person because you do. People like me have perfectly valid reasons to use Windows. Stop bashing everyone because they don't use the operating system YOU have decided is better "for everyone".

Thanks.

haha - I'm not bashing anything, I'm just trying to show people "the light" - Switch to Linux! )

[quoteb35cf61ef6]So not everyone uses Linux. Like I said, it doesn't make you some kind of better person because you do[/quoteb35cf61ef6]

I don't think I was ever saying anything like that.

[quoteb35cf61ef6]and have no actual valid reason to use a different OS.[/quoteb35cf61ef6]
...spyware, viruses, malware, software cost...


[quoteb35cf61ef6]PLEASE, for the sake of the rest of us, get over this superiorty complex you have. It's just an operating system - it's not the end of the world. [/quoteb35cf61ef6]
Hey we're both writing long ass essays lol

Linux is a pain in the ass...i reverted back to Windows XP because i hate doing half the stuff using command line...

i say i <3 GUIs.

[quote214c1abfb2="techdude05"]Linux is a pain in the ass...i reverted back to Windows XP because i hate doing half the stuff using command line...

i say i <3 GUIs.[/quote214c1abfb2]

You should give it another try - try out Suse or Linspire - both have little to no necessary command line aspect - personally I like the command line (thats why I run Debian) but it's not for everyone.

If anyone is persueded to try Linux, a good way to start is by trying out knoppix - it's a live CD that allows you to try a complete linux system without configuring or installing anything on your HD, it boots off of the CD. http//www.knoppix.com

[quote45a5b2920e="Phossil"][quote45a5b2920e]and have no actual valid reason to use a different OS.[/quote45a5b2920e]
...spyware, viruses, malware, software cost...[/quote45a5b2920e]

It's shit like that which makes me dislike people such as yourself very, very much. I know people like you in person. And you know what? They're all arrogant pricks.

I'm way too tired to argue my standpoint any further.

[quotec7a811aff6="shifuimam"]
It's shit like that which makes me dislike people such as yourself very, very much. I know people like you in person. And you know what? They're all arrogant pricks.

I'm way too tired to argue my standpoint any further.[/quotec7a811aff6]

Haha - dude, I'm just promoting an operating system, I have no idea why you are trying to attack me personally. I'm sorry you dislike me, but if you read my long ass "essays" then you'll see I have never attacked anyone personally and I am just stating facts about operating systems. I think you're making inferences from what I write that are not necessarily true, like earlier when you accused me of saying all people who don't use "my" operating system "lower than me" which is not only not found in my posts, but it's not even inferred in my posts.

Personally I don't think that qualifies me as an "arrogant prick" but hey - you're entitled to you're opinion.

What I mean is that you make the blanket assumption that by my using Windows XP, I MUST just have all KINDS of problems with spyware, malware, viruses, and cost of software, all of which are untrue for an experienced Windows user like me.

People who download anything and everything get spyware, and people who don't use antivirus software and refuse to update windows get viruses. I fall into neither of those categories.

Some of your "facts" were untrue, such as the whole bit about how one program crashing in Windows brings the whole system down - this just doesn't happen in XP, even with Microsoft applications like Outlook, Word, and other Office products.

It's just irritating when people state their biased "facts" in a way that makes it seem as though you MUST be an idiot to use any other software/hardware/OS than what they recommend.

This became kind of hostile - Operating systems can get pretty close to people and they defend it like a religion (I'm guilty of this too )) Anyway, I'm not calling people idiots, most people don't know any better than to use the operating system that came with their computer, for those that are aware of other operating systems there must be other reasons for their choice to stick with it.

My argument is Linux = no viruses and spyware, Windows = lots of viruses and spyware - even if you don't have any, they are out there, and if you are able to keep your computer well defended, then I tip my hat to you ma'm (I don't know how to spell ma'm)

Anyway, as this got hostile, I'm not going to post anymore on the subject - I'd prefer not to have internet enemies )

[quote0a98970568="Phossil"]
My argument is Linux = no viruses and spyware, Windows = lots of viruses and spyware - even if you don't have any, they are out there, and if you are able to keep your computer well defended, then I tip my hat to you ma'm [i0a98970568][b0a98970568] (I don't know how to spell ma'm) [/i0a98970568][/b0a98970568]
[/quote0a98970568]

I believe it is spelled ma'am.... ) D

Mac Processors have a better refresh rate than AMD Or Intel making it twice as fast.

2.0ghz intel = 4.0ghz mac

Same with Sun processors D

dont you meen 1.0ghz mac = 2.0ghz intel/amd ?



plus, whats the use of the speed if you have no programs to run?


unless your into grafic design.....and stuff like that.

lol...90% of home/personal computer users don't even need a 2.0ghz intel/amd. Seriously, at most you need a 1.0ghz to run XP and general computing applications - everything else is just for games, which aren't really made for Mac, so...

Some of the graphic apps, like photoshop and whatnot, benefit a /lot/ from bigger processors. But people who just do email, web browsing, and Office apps, yeah, they don't need much.

[quote7bf907270f="shifuimam"]lol...90% of home/personal computer users don't even need a 2.0ghz intel/amd. Seriously, at most you need a 1.0ghz to run XP and general computing applications - everything else is just for games, which aren't really made for Mac, so...[/quote7bf907270f]


exactlymy point

[quote166276a15a="mistwolf"]Some of the graphic apps, like photoshop and whatnot, benefit a /lot/ from bigger processors. But people who just do email, web browsing, and Office apps, yeah, they don't need much.[/quote166276a15a]

Kinda...I ran photoshop on a 1.7ghz p4, and now i've got a 1.6ghz centrino and a 2.8ghz HT p4...there's not a WHOLE lot of difference, aside from loading time when you actually open the application.

Then again, maybe I don't notice a difference since I don't do any of the 1337 advanced stuff. )

No...Mac processors and Sun processors have a %50 better Refresh rate on the chip

Oh, I know they may be better/different than x86 processors...I'm just saying that I haven't noticed a big difference in using photoshop with various speeds/FSB/etc of x86 processors.

ok, go buy a Quad 75 mhz Sun Supersparc II and a Quad Opteron 850 or whatever the hell number it is with each processor at like 2.4ghz

Tell me which one renders a bmp at 30000x30000 faster 8)

bottom line everyone hates macs here.

[quoted6f614017b="techdude05"]bottom line everyone hates macs here.[/quoted6f614017b]

I don't hate them. My first free offer completed will likely be minimacs. But I don't, overall, see much advantage to them over an x86 PC, especially in the software arena. And the problem is that it is hard to argue against that point; even people I know who love their macs, admit that they can't really offer a solid reason to people on why they should switch. So I don't hate them, I just... Don't see the point to them, I guess.

i am getting a macmini from OC to use as a living room or bedroom computer. My current PC sounds like a jet airplane taking off in my room.

Honestly, the biggest hindrance for PC is the Windows platform. I'm sick of bugs and I'm sick of viruses. My everyday use includes web surfing, music, email, and basic word, excel, or PP use. These things can be done just as well on a Mac (NeoOffice/J, baby!). However, for my occasional gaming or use of AutoCAD and other engineering programs will probably keep me at least partially dependent on a PC for the rest of my life.

[quotead54f17677="Lightsky"]ok, go buy a Quad 75 mhz Sun Supersparc II and a Quad Opteron 850 or whatever the hell number it is with each processor at like 2.4ghz

Tell me which one renders a bmp at 30000x30000 faster 8)[/quotead54f17677]

Yeah, I FREQUENTLY fuck with 30,000 square-pixel graphics. roll

I'm telling you, we need to all get Sun workstations and switch to Solaris.

Sunfire 25k's

Say we all buy a oc192 and one of those babies

over 100 processors
like 100tb of ram and like 1PB of hdd

only like $5,000,000

[quote3f917fb5a9="ENGRDawg"]i am getting a macmini from OC to use as a living room or bedroom computer. My current PC sounds like a jet airplane taking off in my room.

Honestly, the biggest hindrance for PC is the Windows platform. I'm sick of bugs and I'm sick of viruses. My everyday use includes web surfing, music, email, and basic word, excel, or PP use. These things can be done just as well on a Mac (NeoOffice/J, baby!). However, for my occasional gaming or use of AutoCAD and other engineering programs will probably keep me at least partially dependent on a PC for the rest of my life.[/quote3f917fb5a9]

jet airplane PC? yea!! same here!

as for the Win32 programs, theres always VirtualPC[=http//www.microsoft.com/mac/products/virtualpc/virtualpc.aspx]VirtualPC

If you're getting it for free anyway, switch to Mac. You'll use it for a week and wonder why the hell you didn't switch sooner.

The big argument is always "but there's SO MUCH software available for Windows." Yeah, but 90 percent of it is complete crap.

Mac software is available to do anything you want to do on a PC. The OS has a lot of features built into it like the ability to PDF ANY document with the print command, for example.

Macs require MUCH less maintenance. I can surf the Web without worry. I don't worry about viruses.

In a nutshell, I'm certainly biased. I hate Windows PCs and think they're absolute crap. I love Apple products. But you need to really look at the cost of ownership of the two. You need to compare feature to feature and realize that Macs are very competitvely priced and are PACKED with features. You need to try OS X and see what a good OS looks like. (Longhorn? Please. It won't come close to Unix-based OS X. Not in a million years.)

I've said it before and I'll say it again The clock is ticking. Microsoft is setting itself up to fail, big time. You may as well try out some other alternatives. If you can get the Mac for free, why not do it?